MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,144 Location: Vancouver Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Frankenstein'ed LM Linea Grinder: Anfim Super Caimano Vac Pot: 1922 Silex Drip: Krups Moka Brew Roaster: Hottop
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 1:51pm Subject: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
Rob Goble asked me in the Cindy Chang WBC thread why I wasn't attending this year's SCAA or WBC. Here's my response. I'd like to hear from site regulars about how they feel regarding coverage of barista competitions or the SCAA trade show.
I'm not attending or covering the SCAA or WBC this year because of several reasons;
- our budget when we attend any SCAA show is approximately $4,500 for all the expenses for three or more flights, hotels, incidentals; we had five people at the Seattle show, four at Charlotte, three at Atlanta, Long Beach and two people at Minneapolis and Boston. I attended Anaheim on my own.
- readership of SCAA reports on this website is down every year since Seattle in proportion to the site traffic. When I covered Anaheim back in 2002, that was huge - pretty much every site visitor during that time was reading the articles and feedback was enormous. Boston was even bigger in terms of overall readership. Atlanta dipped just a bit, but Seattle was the biggest overall for readership vs. visitors to the website. Then starting with Charlotte, it really started to dip. We had less readership of the Minneapolis reports than we have since Atlanta 2004, and our site traffic was about 3.5 bigger than it was in 2004, meaning readership is WAY down for this content. Discussion was equally way down.
- polls and some informal studies we've done show that our average readership doesn't hold much interest in barista competitions or the SCAA show; in terms of the SCAA show, the most common comment I got was there's nothing of interest to consumers (and I work my butt off to find consumer-oriented things at the show each year); in terms of the barista competitions, again, it was the third lowest-voted content request in a recent poll I did - people just don't want this kind of coverage.
- not just in my opinion, but in the opinion of a lot of our readers, barista competitions are a lot of self-congratulations and such, (to put it politely), but still not really much about reaching the public with the concept of culinary coffee, even though that was clearly listed as a mandate in the goals of various national and world barista championships.The big side area with machines and baristas pulling shots for the public is a good move this year, and if it actually does create more direct awareness of culinary coffee with the general public (as opposed to just barista on barista action (no jokes pls! :))), then I may revisit this opinion.
- not the least of which, these secondary, non coffee towns (apologies to Octane) are just ridiculous choices to host the SCAA at. Atlanta gets two visits in 5 years, and Seattle gets one in 10? What the heck is up with that. I have my theories on what is up with that; the SCAA wants to be the 'big game in town" and doesn't want to be swallowed up and anonymous in a big city like Chicago or NY; the SCAA wants cheap conference centres, and places like Charlotte, Atlanta, Minneapolis, etc offer that up; and in the case of Atlanta, they're probably hoping CNN, which is part of the conference centre, will be popping by multiple times a day to film news bits. The SCAA should be going to Seattle. To Portland. To New Orleans. To San Francisco. To Chicago. To Pittsburgh for the cripes sakes. To Philadelphia. To New York City. I am probably going to Anaheim next year, but I'm done going to these secondary towns.
All that said, going to the show this year would basically equate me paying up to $2000 if I went myself, and $3500 or more if I started putting a team together to cover the show, and it would be me paying this money just to go and hang with some really good friends, attend parties and such. I couldn't justify the expense this year, though I'm personally gutted I'm going to miss some dear friends, including Emma Markland Webster, Inny, Dave Makin, Carl Sara, and many more. With the money being eaten up by the site rebuild, I just couldn't justify the trip.
In a way, this is also an experiment. I was half-heartedly trying to organize some people to write show reports for me that I would publish on the website, but I'm probably not going to do that now, so this will be an SCAA free (more or less, there'll probably be mention) on the website this week. But I'm also going to publish some content, and get a podcast or two out the door.
With regards to readership / interest, I would imagine how the show is covered on the Internet today vs 2002, 2004, even 2005 is different. Back then, CoffeeGeek was pretty much the only major, all encompassing coverage of the trade show. Today, we're inundated with bloggers and twitterers and such that cover their favourite subjects at the trade show and competition. All this recent coverage, even though its highly fragmented, has diversified where readership is going to read about the SCAA trade show and barista competitions. As a result, it's probably diluted our own readership and interest.
But, the fact is, no one was covering the SCAA show the way this website was in years past (and I still like to boastfully think no one has ever done the full range of coverage, including 10-15 or more updates a day, hundreds of photos (relavent, tagged and described photos, not just throwing up one's memory card onto flickr), video, and focus on everything topical and relevant at the trade show, not just a barista comp blog or the "cool kids" booths only). The SCAA had no intensive media coverage going out to the general public in 2001 or before (apologies to Barry Jarrett's show reports in alt.coffee); we did it in 2002 and beyond, and the rest of the internet kind of caught up by about 2005-2006 or so, but the coverage by other online ventures was always pretty focused on specific things these site owners and bloggers wanted to cover, instead of an overall view of the trade show, including seminar reports, barista training reports, cupping lab reports, trade show floor reports and interviews, sponsor reports, gala event coverage, the parties, the competitions, the works.
I'm going to be voraciously reading the Net Friday-Monday to see if anyone else steps up and offers general, full exposure coverage of the trade show. If not, this will be the first year in eight that the SCAA doesn't have comprehensive, daily coverage in one package, on one site.
If there's a serious feedback about the lack of SCAA coverage this year from our website users, then I'll know that there should be coverage next year. What do site forum readers think?
tahoejoe Senior Member Joined: 9 Sep 2003 Posts: 314 Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv. Expertise: I live coffee
Grinder: Solis Maestro Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 3:13pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
Mark.. I'm sorry to see you won't be there and do understand about the ROI.
And I must say the statement "the SCAA wants cheap conference centres, " is spot on, a dead on bullseye.
Last year at the expo in Minneapolis with attendance down, I specifically questioned the reasoning behind the future sites of the expo and was told cities such as San Diego, Seattle, San Francisco, Boston etc.. (cities where attendees, exhibitors etc would want to go not only for the show but surrounding sights etc...) were expensive..
It was then I rattled off how the show set-up.. a booth (100 sq ft), a couple of church style long folding tables w/ skirts (whooopee dooo), two hard plastic grade school type chairs, a 120v power source, a cardboard trash can and a round table cost $3500... If you have to get the contract labor force to move a box, assemble a booth of any size, add more power... watch out..
My point was/ is whats a few hundred, hell $500 more to be in a location that will have a better draw given it's already expensive.
This year for me to exhibit will be $5500 for airfare, hotel and booth. That doesn't include any incidentals, food, taxis etc..... Add an extra hotel room for someone kind enough (thanks again Rob) to drive in to help me, dinners for guests etc.. it's another $1500-2000. I repeat..what's 2, 3, 500 more for much better attendance.
My comments are not slights in anyway against people who reside in the cities of Atlanta, Minneapolis etc. or surrounding areas. I enjoy very much meeting everyone, look forward to chatting with the users of Behmor or other home roasting equipment for that matter...the more the merrier. It is merely about an economic reality that we as exhibitors want the best attendance possible. If given a choice, people, new distributors, new users, new whoelsalers from Europe, Australia, So. America, Central Amercica and other far away places, hell even North American look at the expense and need to justify it... They didn't justify it last year at Minneapolis and likely won't this year as well (again nothing against those in Minneapolis, Atlanata areas etc)... but did justify it as Mark stated in Seattle and other cities considered as more prime draw centers.
If the SCAA wanted proof of my point they need to look no further than Mark.. and without the Marks....less is written, less seen, less reviewed etc..
As to CNN.. has anyone seen their ratings lately... If we (SCAA, members and coffee industry in general) tie our success to them we are royally ****ed....
On a side note.... I wonder if the committee that decides expo locales is a branch of the US government?
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 3:29pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
It's happening all over – the intartubes are killing trade shows. I don't know of a single show where attendance isn't down, and that's not just a recent development but one that predates the current economic slump. It's so much cheaper, easier, and more efficient to disseminate information and do marketing through the web, that a lot of larger manufacturers in many different segments are more and more questioning the expense of large trade shows. When a large booth at a show in a venue like Anaheim Convention Center can run a couple hundred thousand in total cost (plus the frequently untallied costs of loss of productivity associated with the gearing up and unwinding from the 'big show'), it's an expense that needs to analyzed.
Once upon a time, trade shows were the best way to get some face to face with your dealer network or your vendors, meet other folks in the industry, do some networking, and see what was new. Now that new products can debut on the web with downloadable manuals, fancy intro videos, interactive online tutorials, and all the other accoutrement that go along with the modern Web 2.0 life, it's far less necessary than it used to be. The only thing missing is hands-on experience, and many manufacturers are finding that it's cheaper to do a traveling road show than it is to hit a couple of trade shows.
So I think the future will hold fewer and smaller trade shows, especially for niche items (and speciality coffee, like musical instrument manufacturing, the market I'm most familiar with, is a niche market), with more and larger growth in web presence and marketing.
MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,144 Location: Vancouver Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Frankenstein'ed LM Linea Grinder: Anfim Super Caimano Vac Pot: 1922 Silex Drip: Krups Moka Brew Roaster: Hottop
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 4:02pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
While I totally agree the Internet is slowly killing trade shows and the concept, I think it's having only a slight impact on shows like the SCAA show. The Internet isn't replacing the need that the speciality coffee industry needs to a) gladhandle, b) meet your distributors, farmers, producers, roasters, vendors, manufacturers face to face, c) party and get drunk (no kidding), something that is very popular with the coffee crowd (hey, at least they don't have much in the way of booth babes).
In fact, I'd argue that trade shows that feature "booth babes" are probably the ones that suffer most cuz of the Internet. They obviously need the booth babes to attract eyeballs; the SCAA trade show hasn't needed that because people have too many other reasons for attending.
I do, however, think the SCAA trade show attendance is down and interest is waning for other reasons of their own doing, already touched on in this thread.
- secondary cites - the pain in the ass it is to travel to some of these secondary cities (there's very few direct flights for those outside the US to places like Atlanta or Charlotte, requiring extra travel pains - the lack of interest in visiting said secondary city by someone who's on the fence about attending a trade show (I know people who aren't going to the SCAA show specifically because of its choice of cities like Minn, Atlanta, Charlotte; they'd go in a heartbeat if it was San Fran, New Orleans, Chicago, etc). - the lack of social entertainment in these secondary cities (I've never seen a town with a more "dead" downtown core than Charlotte. That was freaking bad) - $1000 fees for a symposium, replacing many of the seminars, educationals, labs etc. I think the symposium is a great idea; the fee is very much prohibitive though, and thus attendance is probably going to be way down (I hope not though).
The SCAA has coffee professionals AND consumers, all with varied interests, wanting to attend the SCAA tradeshows if they feel the reasons are valid enough. There's probably hundreds, if not thousands of people in the Specialty Coffee industry as well as enthusiasts who are on the fence about attending; going to places like Charlotte, Minneapolis Long Beach, Atlanta, etc isn't really going to pique their interest, so they don't go. If these shows were in, say San Francisco, I would imagine attendance would be way up.
The SCAA was badly burned by their Miami experience in 2001. They weren't happy with Boston's "treatment" of them and the split level show floor they ended up with. They felt Seattle's convention centre should have offered up more for the price they paid. And perhaps it is because of all of this that the .org is now sticking to places like Charlotte, Atlanta, Minneapolis, Long Beach, Anaheim. But that too will lead to a slow death for this tradeshow, IMO.
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 5:10pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
I'll go to Anaheim. Heck, it's in my backyard. I may even join the SCAA as a cMember for that year. The Anaheim Convention Center, though, is hardly a secondary market. It's one of the most popular venues for trade shows in the country, if for no other reason than being across the street from Disneyland, which means that there's a family element that many people take advantage of. It's also not cheap. Long Beach or Pasadena (or the L.A. Convention Center) would be far cheaper.
Jabes Senior Member Joined: 30 Oct 2003 Posts: 70 Location: Atlanta Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Isomac Tea Grinder: Rancilio Rocky/ Maestro Plus
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 5:30pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
Just one bone to pick...
MarkPrince Said:
- the pain in the ass it is to travel to some of these secondary cities (there's very few direct flights for those outside the US to places like Atlanta or Charlotte, requiring extra travel pains
I'll have to disagree with this one. The Atlanta International Airport is constantly in contention for being the busiest airport in the world. If you have a hard time finding a flight to Atlanta, then I'd say you live a little out of the way of the world's major air traffic routes.
Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport, Atlanta, Georgia, United States:
*Largest number of passengers annually. (1998–2008) *Most arrivals and departures ("operations") annually. (1999–2000, 2005–2007). *In 2007, Hartsfield again set the world's record for most aircraft movements in one year with 994,346. *Most flights (2006).
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 6:05pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
MarkPrince Said:
I do, however, think the SCAA trade show attendance is down and interest is waning for other reasons of their own doing, already touched on in this thread.
- secondary cites - the pain in the ass it is to travel to some of these secondary cities (there's very few direct flights for those outside the US to places like Atlanta or Charlotte, requiring extra travel pains - the lack of interest in visiting said secondary city by someone who's on the fence about attending a trade show (I know people who aren't going to the SCAA show specifically because of its choice of cities like Minn, Atlanta, Charlotte; they'd go in a heartbeat if it was San Fran, New Orleans, Chicago, etc). - the lack of social entertainment in these secondary cities (I've never seen a town with a more "dead" downtown core than Charlotte. That was freaking bad) - $1000 fees for a symposium, replacing many of the seminars, educationals, labs etc. I think the symposium is a great idea; the fee is very much prohibitive though, and thus attendance is probably going to be way down (I hope not though).
The SCAA has coffee professionals AND consumers, all with varied interests, wanting to attend the SCAA tradeshows if they feel the reasons are valid enough. There's probably hundreds, if not thousands of people in the Specialty Coffee industry as well as enthusiasts who are on the fence about attending; going to places like Charlotte, Minneapolis Long Beach, Atlanta, etc isn't really going to pique their interest, so they don't go. If these shows were in, say San Francisco, I would imagine attendance would be way up.
The SCAA was badly burned by their Miami experience in 2001. They weren't happy with Boston's "treatment" of them and the split level show floor they ended up with. They felt Seattle's convention centre should have offered up more for the price they paid. And perhaps it is because of all of this that the .org is now sticking to places like Charlotte, Atlanta, Minneapolis, Long Beach, Anaheim. But that too will lead to a slow death for this tradeshow, IMO.
I for one vote for Toronto, Ontario, Canada as it's centrally located smack dab in the middle of the country. The Toronto Congress Center on the airport strip would be perfect, not to mention it's only 10 minutes away from me!! {;-D
Excerpt: "Canada's newest, largest and most innovative state-of-the-art trade and convention facility. Toronto Congress Centre, one of the largest facilities of its kind in North America, has hosted some of the largest annual shows, events and galas in Canada. With size however, does not come a compromise in quality. We have achieved the almost impossible balancing act - having both quantity and quality. Not only do we boast enough space in our state-of-the-art 500,000 sq. ft. facility - now expanding to 1,000,000 sq. ft.! – but we also offer the service, ambiance and sophistication of a five-star European-style hotel."
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 6:10pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
Mark, I agree with your assessment -- by and large, the consumer interest just isn't there.
Jabes, I was equally puzzled by Mark's comment about the Atlanta airport since I traveled extensively as part of my work for 4+ years. The flight options through Atlanta were huge (I suppose that new-fangled "hub" system might have something to do with). In Mark's defense, he's approximately 3,000 miles from Atlanta so I wouldn't expect his connections with other carriers to be as varied as for those living east of the Mississippi.
Even though I'm within (long) driving distance from the conference center, I am not planning to go, primarily because of job/family commitments and the expected low attendance for non-professionals (formally known at SCAA cMembers). I'll miss seeing the competition, prowling the showroom floor, and meeting some of the people I interact with daily via the forums.
MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,144 Location: Vancouver Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Frankenstein'ed LM Linea Grinder: Anfim Super Caimano Vac Pot: 1922 Silex Drip: Krups Moka Brew Roaster: Hottop
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 7:37pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
Jabes Said:
Just one bone to pick...
I'll have to disagree with this one. The Atlanta International Airport is constantly in contention for being the busiest airport in the world. If you have a hard time finding a flight to Atlanta, then I'd say you live a little out of the way of the world's major air traffic routes.
There are no direct flights from Vancouver to Atlanta; nor were there any in 2004. I'm not sure if this qualifies Vancouver as a "out of the way place on the world's major traffic routes" or not. In reading various blogs from folks outside the US, there are very few direct flights to Atlanta from some major cities outside the US that could easily be nonstop flights to the city. Within the US, Atlanta is a huge hub, and pretty much ever medium/large city has a direct flight. But I was referencing those outside of the US.
That said, it was worse for cities like Minneapolis and esp. Charlotte - I know people who had to make 3 transfers to get to that town.
MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,144 Location: Vancouver Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Frankenstein'ed LM Linea Grinder: Anfim Super Caimano Vac Pot: 1922 Silex Drip: Krups Moka Brew Roaster: Hottop
Posted Tue Apr 14, 2009, 7:45pm Subject: Re: CoffeeGeek not attending or covering SCAA for first time in eight years
GVDub Said:
The Anaheim Convention Center, though, is hardly a secondary market. It's one of the most popular venues for trade shows in the country, if for no other reason than being across the street from Disneyland, which means that there's a family element that many people take advantage of. It's also not cheap. Long Beach or Pasadena (or the L.A. Convention Center) would be far cheaper.
I included Anaheim reluctantly in this blanket mention of "secondary" cities in the past eight years. But here's my order of most-desirable to least desirable cities the SCAA has been to since 2001: there's only two (maybe three) that held any real outside-the-show interest for me, and they're at the top of the list
Seattle (2005) Boston (2003) Miami (2001) Anaheim (2002, 2010) (I'd consider this the lowest of acceptable destination for a coffee trade show attendee, sans family). Long Beach (2007) (at the very least, they had some decent nightlife fairly close to the convention centre; proximity to LA) Minneapolis (2008) Atlanta (2004, 2009) Charlotte (2006)
Se the trend since Seattle? Anaheim is possibly the best of the worst options (imo), but again, the SCAA should really be thinking about destination cities - either coffee destinations (Seattle, Portland, San Fran) or overall destinations (NYC, Chicago, San Fran, New Orleans, Philly, Boston, heck even Detroit, Brooklyn (yes, different name, with its own services), Dallas, etc etc. And frankly, Vancouver would be awesome; as its one of the most desirable to visit cities in the world (not my words, but the picks from top travel mags, Fortune Mag, etc).
Just say no to Toronto. ;) Go Montreal way first.
Mark PS Long Beach was pretty friggin' expensive in 2007; Probably the most expensive (for me at least) since Boston. Seattle cost me more, but that's cuz I paid for five people to attend and cover the show.
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