jwsnyder919 Senior Member Joined: 28 Jun 2011 Posts: 87 Location: All over Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: QM Andreja Premium Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Sat Apr 21, 2012, 10:44am Subject: Any photographers? Debating which camera to get
Looking at my first "big boy" camera system. My ideal camera is:
small outstanding image quality good for landscape/portrait/street -- not much fast action ahead of me. good lenses available Reasonably affordable
The long and short of it is this: fiancee is giving me some cash that I can add on to in order to get some gear. my searches have really turned up 3 main competitors
Fuji x-pro 1 Like the look, love the hybrid viewfinder. Pricey, and has some out-of-the box issues that might take a while for firmware to get around to. But, I think it's more than workable. Big for a mirrorless camera, but felt nice when holding. Limited lens selection, but that's changing over the next couple years according to their roadmap. Lenses fairly reasonably priced by most accounts.
What strikes me as odd about the Fuji is so many people complain about its autofocus issues, chattering, and difficult manual focus. Yet, so many seem to look past this and love the camera. I think this bodes well as I'm sure to be less demanding than many of those reviewers.
Sony NEX-7 Smaller, with outstanding image quality, though tones don't like quite as good as the fuji (though this could be my monitor). Lens selection seems pretty junky, with some notable (expensive) exceptions.
Basically everyone seems to think this could be a great camera. Where people seem to stop short is with a complex menu system and with the lenses. Unfortunate, and cause for much larger pause, to me, than the fuji issues. Have yet to play with one, though. However, cheaper option than the fuji by a not insignificant amount.
Mid-range DSLRs Probably looking at something in the Nikon d5100 or d7000, or Canon 7d/used 5d mark 2 range. These have much better lens ecosystems (duh). and are surely more cost effective. I know new lineups are coming soon, so of course new models could jump into this list.
However, the best camera is the one you have with you. The other mirrorless, smaller options call to me because I'd like to take this camera everywhere. Even if I'm going to just take the camera, the fuji and sony are far less intrusive than a big DSLR. I also fear that I'd get a dslr and have the itch to move to a mirrorless within a couple years. I'm the type of guy that will, 9 times out of 10, go for something at the tip top of the budget now to avoid upgradeitis (see my decisions earlier this year where I spiraled from a gaggia classic/preciso combo to a andreja premium/vario combo....ha!)
Total budget: $1500-$3000 Big range, but less money is usually better! I'd be comfortable going to $2500 and $3000 would really be a stretch. Right now, I'm definitely leaning fuji, but I didn't pull the trigger yet. This definitely says something, me thinks. Figured I'd check with a trusted forum and see if anyone had thoughts.
Daniel437 Senior Member Joined: 20 Apr 2012 Posts: 17 Location: Berlin Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Sat Apr 21, 2012, 11:25am Subject: Re: Any photographers? Debating which camera to get
How much experience in photography do you have? I'm a published photographer and when I was starting out, everyone told me start small and work my way up. I recommend an entry-level or mid-range Canon or Nikon DSLR. Buy the body-- you don't want the stock lens. Figure out what the best bang-for-your-buck general purpose, wide angle and telephoto lenses for your camera are.
Your much better off with an entry-level body and pro lenses than the other way around. My advice is to spend the first $1k or so on your body and one or two lenses, get started and work from there. Once you get more experience in photography your desired features could change.
Even I don't have all the skills yet to maximize the use of some of the equipment in your price range. You're basically wasting money on features you will never make full use of if you buy a professional camera before you gain professional skills.
Posted Sat Apr 21, 2012, 5:21pm Subject: Re: which camera to get.
A major truism in photography IMHO is lens>>>>body. This is akin to grinder>>>machine.
If you look at prices for Canon glass for example you'll see your budget evaporate quickly. Since well built glass can last decades you can then apply the same calculations you did to your espresso equipment budget to justify the cost of buying L lenses. But they do make a huge difference on image quality.
Much of the fun to me is changing what I can get between zooms, prime lenses and macro lenses.
The key to learning photography is mastering exposure and how ISO, aperture, and shutter speed interact. DSLR is probably the best way to learn if you like to have full control (like being fussy with espresso). As you get deeper in and seeing the results of other photographers on Google plus or blogs like the strobist you'll want tripods flashes etc and again DSLR offer the widest range of options.
Nikon and Canon are both great. I have a 7d and love it mainly for the fast action shots. A canon 60d with good glass will do just fine. 5d mkII is your budget essentially. Agree - don't get the kit lens. Get a 50mm prime with a body at minimum.
Doesn't fix the "small" criteria unfortunately. The game changer to me was to ditch the stupid standard strap and get an over the shoulder sling which is much more comfortable and easy to carry around. Micro 4/3 cameras are very intriguing and the glass options are expanding.
jwsnyder919 Senior Member Joined: 28 Jun 2011 Posts: 87 Location: All over Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: QM Andreja Premium Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Sat Apr 21, 2012, 6:09pm Subject: Re: which camera to get.
Thanks for the replies...
I should have given some context -- I consider myself beyond the normal beginner. I was pretty engaged in my photography growing up (god father was often a source of quality hand-me-down bodies (forget which version of the Olympus OM he gifted me) and let me borrow from his $30k+ catalogue of glass regularly), but got away from it as I moved into college. Mostly, this was due to my transience -- I've moved 15 times since I finished high school -- and it became necessary for me to live a bare-bones lifestyle so moving was not difficult. However, now that I've settled a bit, I've been itching to get back into shooting regularly as I've regretted letting it go. Hence, my awesome fiancee saved up enough to prime the budget as an engagement gift (her words: "I get a ring that cost multiple thousands of dollars, you should get something badass").
So, I'm definitely rusty, but understand things better than someone starting from scratch. I know to put my money in the glass first and the body second. (I've been dropping hints to my godfather if he has any glass he'd like to offload, I'm interested).
my first lens will be a decent 50ish mm equivalent. My second will be a good landscape lens (debating the merits of which mm lens to get right now). Then, I'll go from there. I'm not going to pull the trigger on L-quality glass right now -- I'll wait to see what I'm using and how my shooting changes now that I've been away from photography for so long before I pop for L-quality glass (well, maybe I'd just bite the bullet on a 50mm L-quality glass since I'm sure to use that lens a bunch and oh the creamy bokeh). Of course, if I go with one of the mirrorless options, my selections are limited.
And I think you're right, all these cameras are a lot of camera for me right now. I expect to grow more quickly into them than the average beginner, though.
Hopefully this helps as folks give me their thoughts, and thanks to the the replies already.
Right on to this. The Canon 1.4 50mm is a thumping good deal at 370ish and if you can afford the 1.2 even better.
You know those people that want to tell you how to raise your kids but have none of their own? That is how i feel when someone with a kitchen appliance tells me how the merits or dis-merits of my machine or how to use it.
Chang94598 Senior Member Joined: 24 Oct 2007 Posts: 209 Location: SF Bay Area
Posted Sat Apr 21, 2012, 10:55pm Subject: Re: Any photographers? Debating which camera to get
Interesting you should ask camera questions in a coffee forum....
Have you thought about the micro 4/3 mirrorless system? Both Panasonic and Olympus make decent units with excellent lenses. Since one of your requirements is compact size, this should fit the bill.
Panasonic makes Leica spec micro 4/3 lenses that are really fast. Even the Panasonic branded prime is 1.7 with excellent bokeh. The 45mm macro is also desirable. I have since switched to the micro 4/3 system from SLR for traveling. Even the smallest SLR is a behemoth compared to the micro 4/3. Currently the micro 4/3 offers the most versatile lenses. I am always afraid of the Fuji system becomes orphaned.....like my GX.
Why interestingly? This is general off topics - "For general socializing and non-coffee related posts, this is the place to read, post and participate in." Further, the folks I converse with here have proven to be quite nice and I know there are some serious photogs in the group.
Thanks for the MFT suggestion. Worth looking into, but from what I've played with/read, the beefier sensors on the sony/fuji call to me a bit more. Certainly a more developed lens ecosystem at the moment, though.
echris Senior Member Joined: 10 Jul 2003 Posts: 5 Location: Seattle Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Sun Apr 22, 2012, 10:33am Subject: Re: Any photographers? Debating which camera to get
I had a d70 for 8 years, finally died and now I have the d7000. Use them both with a big lens, the 17-55 2.8. I've used point and shoots especially the. Ikon s8200 and Panasonic lx3. The dslr provides better image quality but most important it's available instantly to take a picture, with the point and shoot it takes seconds for lens to unfurl before you can snap the picture.
Posted Sun Apr 22, 2012, 11:15am Subject: Re: Any photographers? Debating which camera to get
I'm just a hobbyist, but I got myself a Canon Rebel Xs a few years back. The image quality is fantastic even for the relatively low 10.1mp, but with your budget you wouldn't have to deal with that. I'd agree that the kit lens isn't great at all, which leads me to my suggestion to get a dslr. The "kit" lens, if you will, on a smaller camera is equally unsatisfactory but you are stuck with it forever.
Just for some comparison, here are a couple quick shots for a bike forum I got with my 18-55mm kit lens and the less than preferable 10mp: Bike
Hope that helps! ~Nick
There's a big difference between drinking coffee to wake up and waking up to drink coffee.
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
= No New Posts since last visit 