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tonyt
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 179
Location: Southern Illinois
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Oscar, Gaggia Coffee
Grinder: Astra, Acaso Mini, Baratza,...
Roaster: SC/CO & Behmor
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 7:58pm
Subject: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

I understand the need for rules but if we do all we can to meet them why not tell us where the rulke was violated.  I got the form leter 1 strikle issues 2 more and you are gone.  So do I try again and see if I am 2/3 the way out or just give up.  All I ask is a little explanation on what is violated.  It seems just as easy as anything else.  I guess I overlooked something.  I can't even see the ad to see what it was.  I know there was  alot of input on this, but for minor offences why not reply with a warning and give 24 hrs to fix things.  Most offenses are due to simple mistakes.  Just my thoughts.  TonyT

mod edit: moved to the Bug Report & Suggestions forum.
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dana_leighton
Moderator
dana_leighton
Joined: 11 Jan 2002
Posts: 1,937
Location: Little Rock, AR
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Isomac Relax; Caferina...
Grinder: Macap MXK; Baratza Vario-W;...
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Drip: Technivorm; CCD; Melitta
Roaster: Poppery I w/PID controller
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:01pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

All of your questions are answered in these topics:
http://coffeegeek.com/forums/members/bugs/419741
http://coffeegeek.com/forums/members/sitenews/415217

 
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
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tonyt
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 179
Location: Southern Illinois
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Oscar, Gaggia Coffee
Grinder: Astra, Acaso Mini, Baratza,...
Roaster: SC/CO & Behmor
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:03pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

I understand, I have read the rules.  All I am saying is if a member makes a mistake wouldn't a simply fix it in 24 hrs be an easier fix?  Or then a strike.  TonyT
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dana_leighton
Moderator
dana_leighton
Joined: 11 Jan 2002
Posts: 1,937
Location: Little Rock, AR
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Isomac Relax; Caferina...
Grinder: Macap MXK; Baratza Vario-W;...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: Technivorm; CCD; Melitta
Roaster: Poppery I w/PID controller
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:07pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

tonyt Said:

I understand, I have read the rules.  All I am saying is if a member makes a mistake wouldn't a simply fix it in 24 hrs be an easier fix?  Or then a strike.  TonyT

Posted May 23, 2009 link

See: http://coffeegeek.com/forums/members/sitenews/421992#421992

 
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
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HB
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Apr 2003
Posts: 2,913
Location: Cary, NC
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:26pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

tonyt Said:

Most offenses are due to simple mistakes.  Just my thoughts.

Posted May 23, 2009 link

Having moderated on CG for over five years, I can say with confidence that the BST forum accounts for the majority of the moderator oversight. As you have noted, attempts to simplify the rules while curtailing commercial exploitation and overall "noise" posts have not gone smoothly. According to Mark, this will greatly improve with CG V3, thanks to automation of the rules governing the BST (e.g., minimum number of posts, length of membership, etc).

In the meantime, I think a "low tech" solution is for a kind soul to post a template of a fully-compliant BST post. Here's my humble attempt after reading the short and long version of the rules:

Required:
Product:
Price:
Conditions of sale, if any:
Seller full name:
Seller location (City/State/Province):
E-mail (optional if in profile):

Seller checklist:
Number of posts to-date or months of membership: N (must be greater than 10 ) or M (must be 3+ months)
Links to external sites: No
Personal sale: Yes (no business or commercial sales of any sort)
Any ties to business, e.g., liquidation: No
E-mail listed in profile or in post: Yes
Coffee related: Yes
Please remember to indicate "SOLD"


Corrections to the above are welcome (especially from the other moderators).

-- Dan

 
www.home-barista.com
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HB
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Apr 2003
Posts: 2,913
Location: Cary, NC
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:43pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

tonyt Said:

I understand the need for rules but if we do all we can to meet them why not tell us where the rulke was violated.  I got the form leter 1 strikle issues 2 more and you are gone.

Posted May 23, 2009 link

Again speaking as a moderator for the last 5 years, sending out personal e-mails is a thankless and frequently frustrating task. Rarely does the receiver say "Oops, sorry, you're right." Instead, they respond with a list of reasons why the rules are unfair, poorly communicated, or my interpretation is flawed. You can imagine how the discussion continues from that point forward. A couple years back, I regrettably resigned myself to using the form letter method simply because I no longer wished to spend my evenings justifying my moderator actions.

As an aside, some of these back-and-forth discussions were mildly amusing, I imagine like the excuses traffic cops must hear for why someone was speeding, went through a red light, etc. Unfortunately, thanks to the anonymous nature of the Internet, some of these exchanges ended with the member "telling me off". That got really tiresome, really fast.

-- Dan

 
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tonyt
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 179
Location: Southern Illinois
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Oscar, Gaggia Coffee
Grinder: Astra, Acaso Mini, Baratza,...
Roaster: SC/CO & Behmor
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:45pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

I understand and appreciate the labor involved in this sight.  I know you are volunteers and we have a free service here.  It also is the number ofpeople who visit and stay active in these forums thta help in the sites advertising.  I recieved a package from Chris Coffee yesterday because of this site.  It is just frusturating to get a warning letter for a simple mistake.  Takes the spirit out of the "we are a community idea".  Not trying to complain and I know nothing is perfect, especially people who post here.  Only been on here about 3 1/2 years which is not long compared to many but simple you have  astrike because you missed something and we have to keep commercial bots off here is a little frustrating.  I will not post anymore on this issue, or maybe not at all I don't know at this point.  Thanks  TonyT
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TimEggers
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TimEggers
Joined: 3 Oct 2004
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Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:47pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

HB Said:

Having moderated on CG for over five years, I can say with confidence that the BST forum accounts for the majority of the moderator oversight. As you have noted, attempts to simplify the rules while curtailing commercial exploitation and overall "noise" posts have not gone smoothly. According to Mark, this will greatly improve with CG V3, thanks to automation of the rules governing the BST (e.g., minimum number of posts, length of membership, etc).

In the meantime, I think a "low tech" solution is for a kind soul to post a template of a fully-compliant BST post. Here's my humble attempt after reading the short and long version of the rules:




Corrections to the above are welcome (especially from the other moderators).

-- Dan

Posted May 23, 2009 link

Amen.

Having the BS&T new posting topic button pull up a form rather than blank text field (then making every field mandatory) would eliminate a lot of the problems.  Then perhaps the follow-ups could be the traditional text box.  Problem solved.

I'm sure Mark has it ironed in the new CG I know I can't wait!

 
Tim Eggers
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HB
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Apr 2003
Posts: 2,913
Location: Cary, NC
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 8:55pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

tonyt Said:

It is just frusturating to get a warning letter for a simple mistake.  Takes the spirit out of the "we are a community idea".

Posted May 23, 2009 link

I understand and hope that the template above reduces the likelihood of an "oops" moment.

While not related to your question directly, I would like to see a "forgive and forget" rule to strikes. That is, rather than 3 strikes and you're banned for life, strikes eventually time out. We have similar rules for points on driver's license in our state. For example, if you get a ticket and you haven't had a previous one in the past three years, you get an automatic pass if it is a relatively minor infraction; you pay the fine, but your insurance doesn't go up. However, if you get a pass and then get another ticket within three years, both tickets are counted towards your driver points and your insurance goes up accordingly.

Applied to CG, for example, that would mean if you get strike, it would "time out" after a year. If you got another strike within the following year, both would be reactivated. Thus to strike out, you would have to consistently break the rules. The infrequent "oops" moment like yours would amount to nothing more than a reminder to stay within 5 miles of the speed limit (at least for the next year <g>).

-- Dan

 
www.home-barista.com
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TimEggers
Moderator
TimEggers
Joined: 3 Oct 2004
Posts: 2,946
Location: Tiskilwa, Illinois
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: QM Anita, Cappuccino Amore
Grinder: Baratza Vario, Mazzer SJ
Vac Pot: Antique McKee, Santos
Drip: Pour Over, Bodum Presses
Roaster: RK Drum
Posted Sat May 23, 2009, 9:01pm
Subject: Re: Strike for Buy Sell ad
 

Pending ability to code I think that's a fantastic idea Dan.

 
Tim Eggers
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