Usually what you state is, based on empiric experience, absolute correct. Even thought - when any grinder breaks, your stuck. Mounted inside or not. I have the Breville "smart grinder" BCG800. Like it or not: The Breville grinder is indeed of decent quality. Fine teeth and solid build give a pretty uniform grain. Technically the same as in the BES900 is build in the BES840. Please check the grind quality out and correct me - I'm always happy to learn from folks who know more then me.
calblacksmith Moderator Joined: 25 Nov 2007 Posts: 5,671 Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A. Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: ECM Veneziano A1 Grinder: Many different commercial Vac Pot: 40s era Silex Drip: Milita, Bunn&Curtis... Roaster: Cast iron pan, gas burner
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 1:05pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
In the U.S. breville is most often regarded as throw away consumer appliances. The BDB has a little better rep but there are still lots of design choices that they made which has a lot of us here still having doubts about breville build quality.
Down under, breville has a better rep and you might get a different opinion from them than you get in the US.
For the mostpart though breville is not a brand we advise anyone to buy.
In real life, my name is Wayne P.
Feed the newbs, starve the trolls and above all enjoy what you drink!
emradguy Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2011 Posts: 1,716 Location: Houston Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II Grinder: MacapM4T, Macap M4, OE Lido,... Drip: Espro press; Aeropress Roaster: internet
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 1:07pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
How did this thread turn into an argument about Breville?
When someone asks for opinions, they will likely get different ones, and that's a good thing. To sit here and argue with everyone who disagrees with you is, at the very least, annoying - if not inappropriate (that's for the moderators to decide).
Frankly, I feel separate components are more desireable. As Qualin pointed out, it's a lot easier to upgrade (without feeling like you wasted your money - in part because you can sell the old component. As Qualin also pointed out, there is a HUGE difference in the cup when one upgrades the grinder (and NOBODY can argue you'll get anywhere close to the quality of a Mazzer anything in an all-in-one machine). If some disagrees, so be it. This is my opinion - so please don't offend me by quoting it and restating your opinion. We already know your opinion...and so does the OP, if she hasn't been scared off by all the bickering!
The Baratza Preciso refurb may be the best grinder for the money ($239 and about about $10-15 shipping). Check here on Thursdays when they update refurbs. Of course if you want it all from the same place in a package there have been other good suggestions.
RaymondParker Senior Member Joined: 10 Nov 2012 Posts: 41 Location: Vienna
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 1:41pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
emradguy Said:
To sit here and argue with everyone who disagrees with you is, at the very least, annoying - if not inappropriate (that's for the moderators to decide).
With all due respect Sir! This is a interesting argument. Absolutely normal and standard - when the Central Committee of China is "discussing" and putting down any from official party-line deviating (opposing / contrasting) positions. Asking for executive "intervention" to "normalise" the turf.
Please have a good hard look at Steve Jobs Stanford Commencement Speech 2005: minute 12:22 if you don't have the time / nerve to watch the enormous enriching speech in full and then think again...
Coffeenoobie Senior Member Joined: 11 Dec 2011 Posts: 2,317 Location: PNW Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: N S Oscar Grinder: Vario W
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 2:54pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
OP: You will need a good tamper and probably a milk pitcher. Good beans are important also. I found that when you are learning you need a lot of beans of the same lot so you can really dial in the grind. I would suggest you get 5 lbs of red bird espresso sent to your house for the same time he gets the machine. I know that sounds like excess but if you get just 12oz or a pound and it takes most of the beans to dial it in then you have to start over with another bean. That is very frustrating when you are first learning. I freeze mine in 1/4 lb lots in zip lock bags that have the vacuum pump feature. If they quit making those I guess I will get a "seal a meal" type machine. Some use jars but I feel that takes up too much room. For him I would probably freeze only half or less of the 5 lbs when I got it. When you first start out you can go through a couple of pounds really fast figuring out what to do. Then pull out the next bag of beans a few hours before you will need it to come to room temp before opening. I am betting in the first 2 weeks he will go through most of the 5 lbs. http://www.redbirdcoffee.com/redbirdespresso.html
To the argument: I hate the disposable mind set of the manufacturers. I hate the idea that my parents will have to toss away their iphone when the battery dies. I dislike combo machines. I have almost always ended up tossing away a machine that was relatively new when I was forced by the market to get a combo. Because when one part broke and was unfixable or the cost more than a new machine. I can't tell you how many fax/scanner/printers I have owned. It is almost impossible to get a plain scanner anymore.
I have tested a BDB and I had a really great shot of espresso from it and it was really easy to steam on. I don't like the fact you to send it back to get it maintained and repaired- end of sentence. Both my husband and I like gadgets and are computer techs, but he did not like the idea of all the electronics in an espresso machine. He said sagely "water and electronics is a bad idea". I had not stopped to consider that but he is right. He would be happier with me having a lever. I got an used "tank built" machine over a BDB. Also, there have been a few used commercial machines I wanted but you can't get the electronics any more or they are very hard to get. I would not be surprised if that is an issue in a few years on the BDB when they change the model. My old car blinker doesn't work any more because I can't get a computer board for it any more.
Coffeenoobie
Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder. My coffee treasure map... Click Here (maps.google.com)
RaymondParker Senior Member Joined: 10 Nov 2012 Posts: 41 Location: Vienna
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 3:07pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
Coffeenoobie - your absolutely right. I have gone the same way with loads of coffee until I found the right setting. With one exception I agree: Over time it gets harder and harder to get also non-computerised spare parts. I had to buy a new machine because for my trusted swiss Turmix TX10 the broken main switch is not anymore available and I could not find anyone reconstructing a replacement.
Coffeenoobie Senior Member Joined: 11 Dec 2011 Posts: 2,317 Location: PNW Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: N S Oscar Grinder: Vario W
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 3:29pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
But you can often get another type of switch to replace it if you are handy or have a machine shop make you one. This is normally not true for a computer board. Maybe that would cool for a small board maker to do, make replacement boards for out of date electronics on demand.
Coffeenoobie
Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder. My coffee treasure map... Click Here (maps.google.com)
qualin Senior Member Joined: 30 Jun 2012 Posts: 463 Location: Calgary, AB Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto 3 Grinder: Mazzer Mini Elect. Type A Vac Pot: Looking to buy Drip: Manual Roaster: Considering?
Posted Mon Nov 19, 2012, 6:51pm Subject: Re: Buying an espresso machine for my husband, help!
WOW! Quite a discussion on here.
When I purchased my Rancilio Silvia, I was kind of blown away that it was the only appliance (Next to the fridge) I had in my kitchen without any electronics in it. It uses strictly electromechanical components. Simple Bimetallic thermostats, three of them.. one for brewing, one for steaming and one to shut the machine down if the boiler gets too hot. All of the rest of the machine "logic" is done with switches on the front. The Gaggia Classic is one of those kinds of machines. It is a somewhat direct competitor (At least IMHO) to the Rancilio Silvia.
I felt like I could use my Silvia through a lightening storm without fail. While the UPS's are chirping and sparks are flying out of other electronics, the Silvia would just hum (Relatively speaking) along. I find it amazing to think that people are getting 20 years worth of use out of these machines. Usually upgradeitis strikes first and the user is on the path to a bigger, better machine! :-) I know I am! :-)
Now, it is unfortunate that it will take Breville probably something close to a decade before they can finally prove themselves and maybe start making the Italian espresso machine manufacturers think twice. Time will certainly tell!
To the OP, Good luck with your purchase and I hope that your husband is very happy with your decision! :-)
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