Our Valued Sponsor
OpinionsConsumer ReviewsGuides and How TosCoffeeGeek ReviewsResourcesForums
Espresso: Questions and Answers
less crema - yummy espresso
LavAzza Espresso Machines
Awesome capsule espresso machines. Perfect for home, office and restaurant applications.
www.espressozone.com
 
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered  
Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Discussions > Espresso > Q and A > less crema -...  
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Author Messages
AndyPanda
Senior Member
AndyPanda
Joined: 12 Jul 2010
Posts: 769
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Olympia Cremina, Various...
Grinder: Mazzer Major, Fiorenzato,...
Vac Pot: vintage Corey
Drip: AeroPress
Roaster: BreadMachine/HeatGun
Posted Sun Sep 19, 2010, 6:31pm
Subject: less crema - yummy espresso
 

So ... I'm fairly new to espresso.  I mean I haven't ever had espresso in Europe or at a third wave cafe (whatever that even is?) - never even really knew what espresso was before 5-6 months ago.  Now I've been totally obsessed and have been working my way up through machines and grinders and learning how to pull a proper shot - and buying fresh roasted coffee as well as learning to roast my own.  And I've been making some great tasting/looking shots - even though I have nothing to compare them to (other than starbucks and I feel like I passed them ages ago).

So ... two things that have been puzzling me.  I usually only roast enough for 3-4 days - but I roasted way too much last month and had some leftover beans from each roasting session that I saved (dated on the bags).  The last few days I've been going back and trying these older beans And to my surprise, the beans that are 2, 3 and even 4 weeks post roast are tasting really good to me.  They have great looking crema as they are being pulled but it quickly thins out to 2-3 mm - still lovely and mottled, just not a lot of it.  

I'm just wondering if this is my uneducated tastebuds - or are people making too big a deal out of trying to get thick layers of long lasting crema?  I know it's the hallmark of fresh beans and a proper grind/distribution, tamp and pull (etc) - but I don't really think crema is all that - I'm really preferring my shots with less crema.  

Am I a heretic?
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
fwtechwiz
Senior Member


Joined: 19 Feb 2010
Posts: 528
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Evolution
Grinder: Hario Skerton
Posted Mon Sep 20, 2010, 3:18am
Subject: Re: less crema - yummy espresso
 

AndyPanda Said:

So ... I'm fairly new to espresso.  I mean I haven't ever had espresso in Europe or at a third wave cafe (whatever that even is?) - never even really knew what espresso was before 5-6 months ago.  Now I've been totally obsessed and have been working my way up through machines and grinders and learning how to pull a proper shot - and buying fresh roasted coffee as well as learning to roast my own.  And I've been making some great tasting/looking shots - even though I have nothing to compare them to (other than starbucks and I feel like I passed them ages ago).

So ... two things that have been puzzling me.  I usually only roast enough for 3-4 days - but I roasted way too much last month and had some leftover beans from each roasting session that I saved (dated on the bags).  The last few days I've been going back and trying these older beans And to my surprise, the beans that are 2, 3 and even 4 weeks post roast are tasting really good to me.  They have great looking crema as they are being pulled but it quickly thins out to 2-3 mm - still lovely and mottled, just not a lot of it.  

I'm just wondering if this is my uneducated tastebuds - or are people making too big a deal out of trying to get thick layers of long lasting crema?  I know it's the hallmark of fresh beans and a proper grind/distribution, tamp and pull (etc) - but I don't really think crema is all that - I'm really preferring my shots with less crema.  

Am I a heretic?

Posted September 19, 2010 link

I'm curious as to what coffee you use, is it SO or a blend?  Crema is a lot more dependant on the sugar content of the beans that are used.  Jeff at Redbird commented to me that his espresso blend is quite high in sugars, which helps dissipate crema.  So if you have a bean that's naturally high in sugars, you can have a perfectly acceptable tasty shot with a nice thin sweet layer of crema on top, and not fear excommunication.
As for the age of the beans, I've seen the rule of 15's and to me, 15 days post roast is a rule that's made to be broken...or at least bent.  As long as the taste is there, go for it.  You'll know when you hit a garbage shot that smells like old socks that you've gone too far.   lol  
Trust your taste buds, 'cause in the end that's the only thing that really matters.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
AndyPanda
Senior Member
AndyPanda
Joined: 12 Jul 2010
Posts: 769
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Olympia Cremina, Various...
Grinder: Mazzer Major, Fiorenzato,...
Vac Pot: vintage Corey
Drip: AeroPress
Roaster: BreadMachine/HeatGun
Posted Mon Sep 20, 2010, 7:13am
Subject: Re: less crema - yummy espresso
 

Thanks for the reply - I've been meaning to order some Red Bird to try, I'll have to follow through and get some.

The beans I was talking about are an El Salvador San Gabriel Bourbon SO roasted between FC+ and Viena.  I did several small batches as I was experimenting with the level of roast and in particular trying to proceed slowly from 1c to end of roast (3-5 min).  In general just 10-20 seconds into 2c - (just a hint of oily shine starting to show 3 weeks post roast) but some a little less, some a little more - some slower, some faster.   That's why I had several dated samples going back so far - comparing the different roasting profiles to try and learn how they differ in taste.

I also still have half a bag of Moka Kadir espresso blend roasted by Sweet Marias about one month ago - I didn't care for it at all when I bought it (roasted way too light for my tastes) but I try it again every once in awhile and I thought it kept getting a little better tasting with age as the brightness mellowed out so I could taste the carmel and chocolate underneath all that fruity tea taste (I'm not a fan of bright coffee yet) - still didn't like it though.

And I had the last bit of some Mexican Chiapas that was about one month post roast - didn't think that was nearly as good as when it was fresh - so that SO was one that did show its age.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Discussions > Espresso > Q and A > less crema -...  
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered     Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
Discussions Quick Jump:
Symbols: New Posts= New Posts since your last visit      No New Posts= No New Posts since last visit     Go to most recent post= Newest post
Forum Rules:
No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards.
No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum.
No SEO style postings will be tolerated. SEO related posts will result in immediate ban from CoffeeGeek.
No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum.
Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards.
Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics.
Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies.
Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies.
Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts.
Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
Learn @seattlecoffeegear
Learn all about coffee, watch videos, read how-to articles.
www.seattlecoffeegear.com
Home | Opinions | Consumer Reviews | Guides & How Tos | CoffeeGeek Reviews | Resources | Forums | Contact Us
CoffeeGeek.com, CoffeeGeek, and Coffee Geek, along with all associated content & images are copyright ©2000-2014 by Mark Prince, all rights reserved, unless otherwise indicated. Content, code, and images may not be reused without permission. Usage of this website signifies agreement with our Terms and Conditions. (0.230265140533)
Privacy Policy | Copyright Info | Terms and Conditions | CoffeeGeek Advertisers | RSS | Find us on Google+