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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Rancilio Silvia...  
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cjcruz
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Joined: 21 Oct 2013
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Location: San Juan, PR
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: De'Longhi EC155
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Posted Tue Feb 11, 2014, 6:12pm
Subject: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

Hey guys! Can anyone spot a change? I see at least one difference...

Guess what?

cjcruz: silvia_iso.jpg
(Click for larger image)
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emradguy
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emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,305
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4, Pharos,...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Wed Feb 12, 2014, 7:13am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

It's a crying shame that they have yet again "upgraded" the machine design in such a minimal fashion.  If they'd only put a damn PID on it, it would go a long way in sales and they'd get so many more recommendations from the home enthusiast sites.

Sadly, they'll probably even jack up the price because it's a "new" version...dispicable!

 
.
Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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cjcruz
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Joined: 21 Oct 2013
Posts: 2
Location: San Juan, PR
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: De'Longhi EC155
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Posted Wed Feb 12, 2014, 7:38am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

Did you notice the longer steam wand?
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CMIN
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Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,507
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Wed Feb 12, 2014, 8:14am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

emradguy Said:

It's a crying shame that they have yet again "upgraded" the machine design in such a minimal fashion.  If they'd only put a damn PID on it, it would go a long way in sales and they'd get so many more recommendations from the home enthusiast sites.

Sadly, they'll probably even jack up the price because it's a "new" version...dispicable!

Posted February 12, 2014 link

Considering they always raise the price with their "incremental upgrades" be funny to see how much worse of a value it is now lol. It's so far over priced, at least put a PID on it Rancillio at that price. It's already barely less than a CC1 which pretty much slaps it out of the box in everyway (larger boiler, full PID control, seperate thermoblock for steaming). The Le'Lit PL041 is like a hundred bucks cheaper and comes with a PID.
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emradguy
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emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,305
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4, Pharos,...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Wed Feb 12, 2014, 8:26am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

No, I didn't notice the steam wand length...whoop-de-doo for them! I haven't has a Silvia in over 2 years, and it was a v1, though I did have a v3 wand on it. So, although I may have noticed if I looked hard enough, and have seen pictures of v3s, and even have a frined with a v3, that I used one day to help him serve 15 people, I wouldn't probably notice the wand length over all the other changes from the one I owned.

+1 to Chris' comment about further decrease in value - now that they've managed to do nothing of significance to improve the machine, yet raise its price.

 
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Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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frcn
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frcn
Joined: 23 Dec 2001
Posts: 3,455
Location: Northern California
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Vibiemme Domobar Double
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Vac Pot: Hario, 2 Cory pots, 1 Cory...
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Bunn A10 mod...
Roaster: computer controlled Hottop,...
Posted Wed Feb 12, 2014, 12:02pm
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

The version numbers on Silvias are so misleading. The one big change they made is not considered:
v1 - Up to about late 2000. These had a bolt-in heating element. As they aged the washer gaskets that sealed the element were prone to leaking.
v2 - Late 2000 and on. The heating element was welded in and part of the boiler body.
Next change (2002?) was using a 100c (?) brew thermostat because people were complaining about steam in the brew cycle.
The only notable change later was the use of an easy to adjust pressure relief valve. Other than making production easier it was a fairly useless update since the machine has no pressure gauge.

All the other changes were of minimal value- fancy portafilter handle, fancy steam valve knob, redesigned drip tray cover (prettier design for the holes). None of these help produce better espresso, and really, no changes they have made since the first version did anything substantial to improve its function.  

Silvia - $629
Crossland - $699
Gaggia Classic - $379
Gaggia Baby Twin - $399
Gaggia New baby - $259

Of that list I have only owned or used the Silvia which I sold in May of 2007 after 6 years of use. Where does Silvia place now in the world of home espresso machines? Is it a good recommendation for a starter machine? Is it as, or nearly twice as good as the Gaggia machines? Would you recommend the CC1 over the Silvia?

$560 - Preciso + New baby
$629 - Preciso + Gaggia Classic.
$830 - Vario + Classic
$850 - Vario + Baby Twin

We could discuss resale value, but should that be a prime consideration for a first time user? Already looking to sell even though they have not previously owned an espresso machine? Not exactly the picture of long-term commitment.

 
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calblacksmith
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calblacksmith
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
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Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
Grinder: Azkoyen Capriccio, Major
Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
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Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 7:03am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

OHHHHHH  AHHHHHHHHH

OK, that's out of the way. I agree that there is most likely a price hike in the near future. Sad thing as it is so far behind the tech curve and the price is still up there.

Quite honestly, even with PID I feel it should retail at about $500 considering that the CC1 is clearly a step up. I did a full rebuild on a V1, V2 heater/boiler, new pump, PID, OPV, mod to make pressure adjustments easier, strip, paint, the works and I have about $500 in it with the used purchase and all the upgrades. On a production line the costs should be a lot less as I paid retail for a lot of the parts used.

It is a shame, Sylvia has a good rep but sadly, it is from past laurels not today's market.

 
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Burner0000
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Joined: 28 Jul 2011
Posts: 1,090
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Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, VFA Expres...
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Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 7:26am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

Yup... It sucks.. Rancilio has been doing all kinds of upgrades and new product releases in the commercial world but it looks like they have left behind their home line.
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CMIN
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Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,507
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 9:42am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

calblacksmith Said:

OHHHHHH  AHHHHHHHHH

OK, that's out of the way. I agree that there is most likely a price hike in the near future. Sad thing as it is so far behind the tech curve and the price is still up there.

Quite honestly, even with PID I feel it should retail at about $500 considering that the CC1 is clearly a step up. I did a full rebuild on a V1, V2 heater/boiler, new pump, PID, OPV, mod to make pressure adjustments easier, strip, paint, the works and I have about $500 in it with the used purchase and all the upgrades. On a production line the costs should be a lot less as I paid retail for a lot of the parts used.

It is a shame, Sylvia has a good rep but sadly, it is from past laurels not today's market.

Posted February 13, 2014 link

I've always said it should be priced just a little higher then the Gaggia Classic which has barely budged in price all these years and is priced right. The current pricing of Silvia, only people buying that either A) are clueless to whats available in the market, B) half brained lol. Nevermind that places that offer it new + PID charge what you can almost get into entry H/X territory, that's nutz. Even the Le'Lit PL041 is a really nice machine in this class, and looks better, and comes with PID for over a $100 cheaper then the Silvia new price. I mean with the CC1 for barely more money you getting a machine that has a much larger boiler at 17oz, and not just a pid slapped on but fully integrated PID control that basically controls every aspect of the machine, separate thermoblock for steaming, and never have to worry about filling and burning out the boiler like can happen on the Silvia.

Burner0000 Said:

Yup... It sucks.. Rancilio has been doing all kinds of upgrades and new product releases in the commercial world but it looks like they have left behind their home line.

Posted February 13, 2014 link

I've said for awhile Rancillio doesn't care about the home consumer, if they did, at the very least they would of retooled the Rocky Grinder to at least be stepless and fix it's other deficiencies like home users have to mod them. Then you have so many newbies buying that combo which is so far over priced and then coming on here or the other forum and wondering why their so frustrated making good coffee, b/c the positive reviews they read didn't notice they were like 10 years old lol.

They care about the commercial market. Though in regards to that I've realized over the last few years I don't think I've been to a shop that had anything Rancillio. Anybody else see that? Always nicer machines and grinders, actually the only Rancillio setup I can recall is a diner by me that has an old grinder and old two group machine.
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emradguy
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emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,305
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4, Pharos,...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 9:59am
Subject: Re: Rancilio Silvia V4?
 

CMIN Said:

... I don't think I've been to a shop that had anything Rancillio. Anybody else see that? Always nicer machines and grinders, actually the only Rancillio setup I can recall is a diner by me that has an old grinder and old two group machine.

Posted February 13, 2014 link

I've seen a lot more Rancilio commerical machines in other countries, but agree...here in the US, very rare.  In fact, I'm kind of surprised you don't see more of them in South Florida.

 
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