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Another DB Quickmill
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Another DB...  
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CarloM
Senior Member


Joined: 1 Apr 2013
Posts: 321
Location: Los Angeles
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Vetrano V2B
Grinder: Mazzer Mini-E Type A, SJ...
Drip: Toddy
Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 6:30am
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

Hi Dean,

Sorry to hear about this. I have not experienced anything like what you describe. I do not leave my machine on all day, but I do allow it to warm up between 30-60 minutes (a couple of time I've left it longer because I didn't get to make coffee at the time I thought I would). So I'm hoping this won't be a "known issue" meaning something that happens semi-regularly to a certain percentage of machines. I do use the hot water tap to heat my cup, so I'm familiar with what you describe about the pump kicking on to refill the steam boiler but that really only lasts for about 3 seconds at the longest.

I think maybe you should place a call or email your problem to CCS who can work with QM to investigate the issue you describe. If it starts to happen regularly then you definitely have a problem. If it happens once it may have been a hiccup.

One thing that may ease some of your concern: I don't think I've heard the autofill randomly kick on. It kicked on for me the first time I turned on the machine. For the first month of ownership it would sometimes kick on when I turned on the machine (it hasn't for the last couple of weeks). And it kicks on after I draw enough water from the hot water tap. I haven't heard it kick on any other time. So I think the chance of it kicking on and keep on trying to fill the boiler while you're gone is low. If you're really concerned though, you may want to consider getting a timer rather than leaving it on all the time.
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DavecUK
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,386
Location: UK
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 12:31pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

DeanOK Said:

Issue: Pump will not shut off trying to fill steam boiler

This morning I drew a few ounces of water from my steam boiler. The pump kicked on to refill the boiler. I am used to this sequence and didn't pay much attention.... but then, the pump kept running and running and didn't shut off. I had only removed about 2 to-3 oz of hot water from the boiler. After the pump ran 45 seconds or so I got to paying attention. The noise was different. I reached over and opened up the brew valve to let water pass through the brew head. The noise of the pump changed (got quieter) and then the pump kicked off within 5 seconds or so.

I am using the internal tank. The last time the machine was used was yesterday morning... so it set about 24 hours before I drew the water from it this morning. The internal tank is about 3/4 full.

I believe that if I had not been there and observed this, the pump could have ran for hours. This bothers me because I leave my machine on all day, even when I am gone from home. Has anyone else experienced this?

Posted October 10, 2013 link

Nope, mines been on for 16 hours per day every day (when I'm in) for months, although If I go out (e.g. no ones in the house), I tend to turn the machine off.. Also if it's any reassurance, the autofill side of the machine and the steam/HW boiler side are all totally standard technology used across the QM range. So nothing new there to introduce a fault peculiar to that machine. If the water sensor probe in the steam boiler  has an open circuit pump will run, when water reaches bottom of probe, pump will stop as a small amount of current is passed.. The only 2 ways that ANY machines HX/DB etc.. keep running is:

  1. The probe is showing as open circuit
  2. There is a fault in the Gicar/Giemmie/whatever autofill controller.

It could be as simple as a loose wire in the spade connector that connects to the probe at the top of the steam boiler. Or other bad connection.
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DeanOK
Senior Member
DeanOK
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 647
Location: OK
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: QM Vetrano 2B
Grinder: Vario W
Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 12:54pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

DavecUK Said:

Nope, mines been on for 16 hours per day every day (when I'm in) for months, although If I go out (e.g. no ones in the house), I tend to turn the machine off.. Also if it's any reassurance, the autofill side of the machine and the steam/HW boiler side are all totally standard technology used across the QM range. So nothing new there to introduce a fault peculiar to that machine. If the water sensor probe in the steam boiler  has an open circuit pump will run, when water reaches bottom of probe, pump will stop as a small amount of current is passed.. The only 2 ways that ANY machines HX/DB etc.. keep running is:

The probe is showing as open circuit
There is a fault in the Gicar/Giemmie/whatever autofill controller.

It could be as simple as a loose wire in the spade connector that connects to the probe at the top of the steam boiler. Or other bad connection.

Posted October 10, 2013 link

It sounded as if the pump was running, but not pumping. I believe there was air in the pump and that it was cavitated. Just as soon as I opened the brew valve, the pump's sound changed. I turned the brew valve off within a couple of seconds of turning it on and the steam boiler fill demand was satisfied within 5 seconds of closing the brew valve.
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JaniceAnn
Senior Member


Joined: 15 May 2013
Posts: 185
Location: Virginia
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 3:56pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

My machine is making that noise too.  It does it when I first lift the lever and then again if the machine has been sitting a while.  I do not leave the machine on all the time.  It is turned on in the morning, then off.  Turned on again in the afternoon and then off again.  I am not using the steam boiler at all right now but will be when I start learning to steam milk.

The noise is really starting to bother me but, then again, I am really sensitive to noise so that may be a good part of it.

The water I am using tests at 1.5 grains on my test strips.  At least I think that is correct.  They are good test strips and the color changes are very different so they are easy to read.  The color I get is exactly the color
for 1.5 grains of hardness which is a dark green.  It is more of a burnt orange for 3 grains of hardness.

I am wondering if I should be adding tap water to make the water be 3 grains of hardness or if what I am using is okay.

I am thinking of emailing Chris' to complain about the pump noise but I wanted to ask what you all, especially Dave, think about this.

Would taking the little filter thingy off the water intake line make any difference or is there something else that I should do?

Thanks for your help!
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schwaggy
Senior Member


Joined: 5 Apr 2013
Posts: 20
Location: Seattle
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto III
Grinder: Mazzer Mini E Type A w/ SJ...
Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 5:26pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

It sounds to me like your pumps are losing their prime. Are you both running from the internal reservoir?
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JaniceAnn
Senior Member


Joined: 15 May 2013
Posts: 185
Location: Virginia
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 6:26pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

schwaggy Said:

It sounds to me like your pumps are losing their prime. Are you both running from the internal reservoir?

Posted October 10, 2013 link

I am.  I fill it every night, last thing.
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DavecUK
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,386
Location: UK
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 6:55pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

JaniceAnn Said:

My machine is making that noise too.  It does it when I first lift the lever and then again if the machine has been sitting a while.  I do not leave the machine on all the time.  It is turned on in the morning, then off.  Turned on again in the afternoon and then off again.  I am not using the steam boiler at all right now but will be when I start learning to steam milk.

The noise is really starting to bother me but, then again, I am really sensitive to noise so that may be a good part of it.

The water I am using tests at 1.5 grains on my test strips.  At least I think that is correct.  They are good test strips and the color changes are very different so they are easy to read.  The color I get is exactly the color
for 1.5 grains of hardness which is a dark green.  It is more of a burnt orange for 3 grains of hardness.

I am wondering if I should be adding tap water to make the water be 3 grains of hardness or if what I am using is okay.

I am thinking of emailing Chris' to complain about the pump noise but I wanted to ask what you all, especially Dave, think about this.

Would taking the little filter thingy off the water intake line make any difference or is there something else that I should do?

Thanks for your help!

Posted October 10, 2013 link

I din't have anything on my tube, all removed and the tube cut (2*45 degree cuts) to a point (to stop it sucking on to the side of the tank and blocking)....I posted about it on this thread a few pages back. Mine makes no noise, but I use RO water and add bicarbonate hardness back (again mentioned earlier in this thread). There are other things in water that cause problems RO eliminates those adding bicarbonate buffers the ph and also adds some dissolved sodium carbonate for hardness, but hardness that doesn't deposit in the same way as calcium carbonate.

Just look at the bore inlet tube, then look at the bore of what's pushed into it and you will see why I removed all fittings (in my case the little plastic doohicky....also I personally don't use the inline softeners, but mine didn't have one!

I've always said 95% of problems are cause by water.
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JaniceAnn
Senior Member


Joined: 15 May 2013
Posts: 185
Location: Virginia
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 7:00pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

DavecUK Said:

I din't have anything on my tube, all removed and the tube cut (2*45 degree cuts) to a point (to stop it sucking on to the side of the tank and blocking)....I posted about it on this thread a few pages back. Mine makes no noise, but I use RO water and add bicarbonate hardness back (again mentioned earlier in this thread). There are other things in water that cause problems RO eliminates those adding bicarbonate buffers the ph and also adds some dissolved sodium carbonate for hardness, but hardness that doesn't deposit in the same way as calcium carbonate.

Just look at the bore inlet tube, then look at the bore of what's pushed into it and you will see why I removed all fittings (in my case the little plastic doohicky....also I personally don't use the inline softeners, but mine didn't have one!

I've always said 95% of problems are cause by water.

Posted October 10, 2013 link

What do you use to add Bicarbonate back?  Isn't baking soda a bicarbonate?  How much do you add per gallon?

Does RO water have any hardness?  I know that distilled water doesn't or so I think.

Thanks!
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emil3m
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jan 2013
Posts: 103
Location: New York
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Vario
Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 8:41pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

Hi all! I'm planning to buy the machine in dec/jan. I'm monitoring this thread, but not very closely because of the sheer volume.

It seems like a lot of people are opening their machine, cutting things, adding things, fixing things, and modifying PID settings to a deeper extent than pressure and temp.

Is this required with the Vetrano 2B? I like to pay top dollar for something that works out of the box. I enjoy keeping a journal where I keep track of how each bean variety ages and how to adjust the grind, dose, tamp pressure, brew time, pull time, and brew temp accordingly. THIS RENDERS ME AS NUTS by all accounts of my friends :)
So by no means do I mind to be bothered as espresso demands that. BUT I am getting a bit turned off by the notion that bleeding edge technology and top dollar gets me equipment that I need to fix and service starting virtually out of the box.

Can anyone please tell me if y'all are just voluntarily crazy :)) or are those actual issues with the machine? (I mean this in the warmest way possible--not trying to offend)

 
Currently in love with Hayes Valley by Blue Bottle--locally roasted next to my house in Brooklyn
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JaniceAnn
Senior Member


Joined: 15 May 2013
Posts: 185
Location: Virginia
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu Oct 10, 2013, 8:51pm
Subject: Re: Another DB Quickmill
 

emil3m Said:

Hi all! I'm planning to buy the machine in dec/jan. I'm monitoring this thread, but not very closely because of the sheer volume.

It seems like a lot of people are opening their machine, cutting things, adding things, fixing things, and modifying PID settings to a deeper extent than pressure and temp.

Is this required with the Vetrano 2B? I like to pay top dollar for something that works out of the box. I enjoy keeping a journal where I keep track of how each bean variety ages and how to adjust the grind, dose, tamp pressure, brew time, pull time, and brew temp accordingly. THIS RENDERS ME AS NUTS by all accounts of my friends :)
So by no means do I mind to be bothered as espresso demands that. BUT I am getting a bit turned off by the notion that bleeding edge technology and top dollar gets me equipment that I need to fix and service starting virtually out of the box.

Can anyone please tell me if y'all are just voluntarily crazy :)) or are those actual issues with the machine? (I mean this in the warmest way possible--not trying to offend)

Posted October 10, 2013 link

I can't speak for anyone else but, yes, I am definitely voluntarily crazy.  Just ask my husband.  ;>)
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