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Giotto Problem
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Giotto Problem  
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frcn
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frcn
Joined: 23 Dec 2001
Posts: 3,351
Location: Northern California
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Vibiemme Domobar Double
Grinder: Mazzer Kony, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Hario, 2 Cory pots, 1 Cory...
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Bunn A10 mod...
Roaster: computer controlled Hottop,...
Posted Wed May 8, 2013, 8:47am
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

The ECM is a HX machine. if you get steam in the "preinfusion" lever position it means that there is not enough water in the HX and it is overheating. Causes:
- Low water level in boiler
- Too high boiler temperature/pressure
- Leak in HX system
- Leaking back through the brew solenoid under pressure of heating

If seals are leaking in the group or if a fitting is leaking slowly, water can slowly escape the HX loop and can vaporize and you will not see it dripping anywhere. Are there any crusty areas inside the machine (at pipe fittings, for example) from scale deposits.

 
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timmangan
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Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 42
Location: Michigan
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Wed May 8, 2013, 9:26am
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

hmmm, there seems to be ater in the boiler, but I will double check. Everytime i raise the lever to pull a shot the pump goes on, would that mean that water is coming straight from the resoivor to the brew head, without drawing from water in the resoivour (cant spell)?

There doesnt seem to be any leaks at all, no water coming out from anywhere that i could see when it was apart.

No crusty spots.

How do i adjust the boiler temperature? and what temp should it be at?
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calblacksmith
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calblacksmith
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 7,672
Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
Grinder: Azkoyen Capriccio, Major
Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
Drip: Msl. Com. brewers
Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Wed May 8, 2013, 1:48pm
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

I did not read every word but just checking, you do flush the over heated water from the brew system before pre infusion right?

 
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Anything I post is personal opinion and is only worth as much as anyone else's personal opinion. YMMV!

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timmangan
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Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 42
Location: Michigan
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu May 9, 2013, 8:33am
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

Hey mate,

I dont often, if ever do a cooling flush, I just did it thoughand what do you know, all good in the hood.

So with the new pump and a cooling flush, the Giotto is back is business.

I just put the brew head back together last night, talk about interesting. I love finding out how things work.

What temp is the boiler meant to heat up to? and How do you make sure that it is heaating to the correct temperature.

I figure, after all his, i may as well make sure that is on point too :)
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calblacksmith
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calblacksmith
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 7,672
Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
Grinder: Azkoyen Capriccio, Major
Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
Drip: Msl. Com. brewers
Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Thu May 9, 2013, 11:20am
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

Congrats!

The proper temp is set by you but typically it is in the 1.1 to 1.5 bar range. This puts the steam boiler to just above boiling to about 240 or more F.
If you do a LOT of shots at the same time, bump the temp up, if it is just one double every now and then, you can set it lower but ALWAYS above boiling temp. The temp is read in BAR, so like I said, 1.1 to about 1.5 bar.

The HX tube runs through the steam boiler so if you are not pulling shots one after the next then the water in the HX tube will become the same temp as the water in the steam boiler or above boiling so when you do let the water flow out of the HX system, you will get steam once the pressure is reduced and 240F water does it's thing. That is why you need to flush the water out of the system, so that the HX is at the proper rate of flow to heat the water properly.

Every machine needs to be flushed so the old complaint about HX flush is really moot. Nearly all DB machines need a WARMING flush and EVERY machine needs the spent grounds flushed from the group head and screens before pulling a shot.

 
In real life, my name is
Wayne P.
Anything I post is personal opinion and is only worth as much as anyone else's personal opinion. YMMV!

Feed the newbs, starve the trolls and above all enjoy what you drink!
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timmangan
Senior Member


Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 42
Location: Michigan
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Fri May 10, 2013, 7:54am
Subject: Re: Giotto Problem
 

Thanks everyone for your help.

I learned a ton about the machine, and got it working again!

Thanks again for all the help.

Cheers
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