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Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
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Ameliej
Senior Member


Joined: 27 Dec 2012
Posts: 6
Location: Cnada
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Sun Apr 28, 2013, 4:05pm
Subject: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

Hello,

Before anything, I'm not the one looking to buy a SA. My father came to me to get advices for a purchase, but i'm at lost, 'cause I own a manual machine...i surely tried to discourage him from buying a sa, but did not succeed...a manual machine is not an option. Anything that ask to use a portafilter or froth milk is over the effort he want to out in getting a good coffee....

I browsed the forum to get buying advices in this particular category, but nothing useful came up...

He wants...
A super-automatic...no grinder included (?)
Plumbed ( again, dont't ask...)
Low maintenance
Budget is not an object

And hoping to get coffee as good as with my lelit PL4TEM/PL053 grinder...

Anybody has a recommendation for me except discouraging him in his shopping or suggesting a pod machine since either SA and pod machine don't offer quality coffee...
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scanfield
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Nov 2011
Posts: 181
Location: Texas
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: La Nuovo Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Sun Apr 28, 2013, 6:13pm
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

I would call a couple of reputable vendors and see what they recommend.

A coworker of mine bought a Saeco Xelsis. If I recall it was around $3000 and he's been very happy with it. I've had a latte from it and it was actually very, very good.

As far as low maintenance goes, that's a tough one. All machines have maintenance involved and it's pretty much the same from machine to machine.
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CHenry
Senior Member


Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Posts: 114
Location: Maryland
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Olympia Express Maximatic
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Electronic Type...
Vac Pot: none
Drip: Technivorm
Roaster: none
Posted Sun Apr 28, 2013, 6:47pm
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

Look at the Nuova Simonelli Microbar.
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qualin
Senior Member
qualin
Joined: 30 Jun 2012
Posts: 646
Location: Calgary, AB
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto 3
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Elect. Type A
Vac Pot: Looking to buy
Drip: Manual
Roaster: Considering?
Posted Mon Apr 29, 2013, 1:54am
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

]You know, these kinds of posts irk me a little.. Here's why.. Show your father this video:

http://youtu.be/mnmmEZ-hMa4

If two five year olds can make espresso, your father can too. (Unless maybe he has bad arthritis or something.)

If he wants to spend $3k-$7k on a Super-auto, have at 'er, but any semi-auto will make better coffee IMO.

At my workplace, they rent a $15k super-auto. My Duetto at home makes better coffee. I'm not kidding either.
The "Double espresso" it makes tastes like moka pot coffee and the cappuccinos it makes taste like cheap
coffee flavored candy.

I admit, I'm spoiled now and I'm being snobby.. but if I had to even think about a super-automatic, what about
a Quickmill Monza Deluxe? At least it has a metal carrier for the brewing mechanism.
Click Here (www.seattlecoffeegear.com)

I can't say I can personally recommend it, but it would be cheaper than the Microbar and Xelsis.

I admit I'm a little confused about the "No Grinder" part though. All Super-Autos have a grinder. If he doesn't want a grinder,
then the only options are a full-auto or a semi-auto pod capable machine. (Think Rancilio Epoca with Pressurized Pod Portafilter.)

 
Garbage In, Garbage Out, for every step of the process. From Beans to grinder, grounds to machine, coffee to cup.
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MerleApAmber
Senior Member


Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 203
Location: Atlanta
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Breville BES900
Grinder: Baratza Preciso + Esatto
Vac Pot: Yuma
Drip: bah-humbug
Roaster: Hot Top 2K P
Posted Mon Apr 29, 2013, 9:39am
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

qualin Said:

You know, these kinds of posts irk me a little.. Here's why.. Show your father this video:

http://youtu.be/mnmmEZ-hMa4

If two five year olds can make espresso, your father can too. )

Posted April 29, 2013 link

- Bud,
THAT was brilliant.  Kudos to Clive Coffee and thank you for sharing.  I had to "Like" that immedately, +1'd to everyone in my Google Circles...
THANK You!

Amelie Jean,
Oh dear, you have your work cut out for you.  Worst thing is, SA does NOT become easy maintenance. At least the units I've used. I took a look at the N.S. owners manual; you might want to too.  There pages 48 to 51 will show you what N.S. recommends for keeping things clean. (which really means keeping it capable of making coffees.)  Can we offer ...french press?... I know, I know... but it would hit most of his hot points.  Otherwise, we have to convince him the effort of cleaning IS part of good/possibly great coffees...
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alnica
Senior Member


Joined: 28 Feb 2010
Posts: 84
Location: Nicaragua
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Vivaldi II
Grinder: Baratza Vario, Porlex Mini
Drip: Hario V60
Posted Mon Apr 29, 2013, 10:46am
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

I have never used one, but this forum has put the fear-of-super-autos in me.

If the quality of the coffee that comes out of a 15 grand super-auto really is no better than a moka pot, then what about suggesting to your father that he save some $$ and buy a few moka pots instead (stove-top or electric). If he doesn't like the idea of the preparation and cleaning involved here, maybe employing a moka-pot-cleaner could do the trick?

If money really were no object, what about getting a non-super-auto and employing someone five years and up to use it?

If quality of coffee is really not an object, and only convenience, I suppose going for any machine that includes a reasonable service package would suffice. As someone already suggested, local vendors could provide info here.

Al
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CMIN
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,213
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Mon Apr 29, 2013, 11:38am
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

Ameliej Said:

And hoping to get coffee as good as with my lelit PL4TEM/PL053 grinder...

Posted April 28, 2013 link

Even a lower end semi setup like yours will outperform a superauto, not in speed and convenience, but by far in taste lol. Main problem with a superauto is the grinders even in high end units are wishy washy and low end ones are completely incapable of grinding for espresso, the machine tamping isn't good, temp's aren't even within range or stability except on expensive units like the Monza, the ones under a grand are basically junk. Reason why an espresso shot out of a superauto even with fresh beans extracts in like 15 seconds and taste like watered down sour coffee. You can't even open one up and work on them really since their so proprietary if something were to go wrong, which isn't an unheard of thing with superautos lol.

Does he just want espresso (or latte's)? Or just coffee in general, if just coffee he'd pry be happy with something like that Breville Youbrew (drip machine w/ built in grinder), neighbor has one and it makes a great cup, couldn't really tell a difference between it and a Technovorm.
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qualin
Senior Member
qualin
Joined: 30 Jun 2012
Posts: 646
Location: Calgary, AB
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto 3
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Elect. Type A
Vac Pot: Looking to buy
Drip: Manual
Roaster: Considering?
Posted Mon Apr 29, 2013, 8:17pm
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

alnica Said:

If the quality of the coffee that comes out of a 15 grand super-auto really is no better than a moka pot,

Posted April 29, 2013 link

Well, again this is IMHO. This is the super-auto at work I'm talking about, so it probably isn't being maintained properly, the beans being
fed into it are probably stale as all heck and for all I know, the last time it was professionally cleaned a different president was in power.

alnica Said:

save some $$ and buy a few moka pots instead (stove-top or electric).

Posted April 29, 2013 link

Well, the whole entire point of espresso is to brew coffee fast and to allow for fast cleanup too. Moka pot is neither. Moka pots demand a lot
of time and are a pain to clean, but again IMHO. They're good if you have company over though or you want to make strong coffee on the cheap.
I have a Moka pot which I keep in the kitchen in case I want to go camping or I'm visiting a friends place.

Personally, I like how repairable semi-autos and autos are. Especially E61 group machines.

 
Garbage In, Garbage Out, for every step of the process. From Beans to grinder, grounds to machine, coffee to cup.
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SStones
Senior Member
SStones
Joined: 24 Nov 2012
Posts: 452
Location: Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Giga 5, ECM Giotto, Rocket...
Grinder: Anfim Milano-Best
Vac Pot: No  :(
Drip: Some $30 thing from Walmart
Roaster: I buy pre-roasted.
Posted Tue Apr 30, 2013, 5:00am
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

Al super autos have their own idea of being "Loe Maintenance", whether that's a removable brew unit that you rinse in the sink or a cleaning cycle that you let the machine run on itself every couple hundred cups.  If money is seriously less important than the lack of maintenance, he should contact a coffee distributor that will give him the machine and look after it so long as he consumes as much coffee as a small office.
Alternatively, he could buy used and trade it in every few months to avoid maintenance, or hire a guy to maintain it for him.  I have to assume his car gets maintained even if he doesn't do it.
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rettaps
Senior Member


Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 264
Location: SD
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: 2011 V3 Vibiemme DB Super...
Grinder: Compak K10 Fresh, Versalab...
Vac Pot: Cona,
Drip: Techniworm, 6 cup Chemex
Roaster: San Franciscan
Posted Tue Apr 30, 2013, 7:31pm
Subject: Re: Super-automatic machine (buying advice)
 

to be honest, i wouldn't buy a super automatic, but i can relate to dad wanting one,
i would buy this for him... Click Here (www.ebay.com)
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