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"forgiving" machine
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > "forgiving"...  
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alekk
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alekk
Joined: 7 Dec 2012
Posts: 22
Location: Paris
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sat Jan 12, 2013, 5:45pm
Subject: "forgiving" machine
 

I was wondering why some espresso machines are more "forgiving" than others in the sense that they can produce good espresso from a wider range of grind/temperature/etc ... For example, I have read at several places that the Europiccola is "not forgiving" when it comes to grind. Is it in fact because the temperature varies a lot between shots?
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Markarian
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Markarian
Joined: 27 Jun 2012
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Location: Seattle Area
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Espresso: ECM Technika IV Profi WT-WC
Grinder: Baratza Forte AP, HG One
Vac Pot: Bunn Trifecta MB
Drip: Moka, Aeropress, Hario V60
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Sat Jan 12, 2013, 10:27pm
Subject: Re: "forgiving" machine
 

I would imagine commercial machines are extremely forgiving, given that they often dose volumetrically and have computer temperature control. They're designed to be used quickly, in high volume, but a minimally-trained barista, so I would (hope) they are.
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dr_java
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Joined: 13 Jan 2013
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Espresso: Silvia, Estro SIN6, Pavoni...
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Posted Sun Jan 13, 2013, 5:54pm
Subject: Re: "forgiving" machine
 

I was wondering the same thing.  For example, high percentage of sites selling the Rancilio Silvia say that it requires a precise grind - I don't see this very often with other machines.  Could it be that it is because it's sort of an entry-level machine for espresso without pressurized PFs?

I was thinking that all non-pressurized PF applications/machines would be similarly less forgiving, and if not, would like to know the technical details of implementing "forgiving".
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Coffeenoobie
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Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
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Location: PNW
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Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Sun Jan 13, 2013, 6:16pm
Subject: Re: "forgiving" machine
 

Yes, pressurized baskets are more forgiving of low end, not espresso capable grinders.  That is not to say the machine it self is more forgiving in general usage.

 
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calblacksmith
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calblacksmith
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Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
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Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
Grinder: Azkoyen Capriccio, Major
Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
Drip: Msl. Com. brewers
Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Sun Jan 13, 2013, 6:29pm
Subject: Re: "forgiving" machine
 

Both ends of the spectrum are more forgiving. The low end machines are not temp stable and come with pressurized portafiltersso the grind is not so critical but because of the poor stability and poor grounds the espresso machine produces so so at best espresso.

On the other end the high dollar machines produce great espresso but at the price of a nice used car.

In the middle you have machines that are fussy but produce or can produce great espresso but at the cost of greater skill on your part.

 
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