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Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Suddenly the...  
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DeanOK
Senior Member
DeanOK
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 650
Location: OK
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: QM Vetrano 2B
Grinder: Vario W
Posted Tue Dec 25, 2012, 9:41am
Subject: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

I have had a CC1 for close to 2 months. Been using several brands of fresh coffee, but mostly one from one roaster Got a new bag in the mail a few days ago and when I put it in the grinder at the settings I had been using for the same brand, it nearly choked the machine. It took me several attempts to get the grinder adjusted because I ended up making the grind much courser. Now when I pour a shot the crema is light and frothy. I always use a 3 oz stainless pitcher to catch the shot. When I make a shot with this latest batch, when I get about 2.5 oz in the pitcher and let it set a minute or so while I steam my milk, the frothy crema will settle and there will be about 1.5 oz in the pitcher.  The coffee is not bad, just different than all of the other bags in the way it makes a shot. Could this bag have frozen in shipment and caused a change or is it just me?

Comments?
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Coffeenoobie
Senior Member
Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3,015
Location: PNW
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Tue Dec 25, 2012, 10:09am
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

All beans are different.  Is this roast lighter than your others? Is it closer to the roast date? That would be my guess- it is a lighter roast closer to the roast date than your other beans.  Some people let the beans rest for a few days before using or freezing.

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

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RomeoMike
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Nov 2012
Posts: 7
Location: Seattle
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto III
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Tue Dec 25, 2012, 3:05pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

Do you have a scale to weigh your shot? I had similar questions about the volume of liquid versus crema in my shots and was turned on to the very helpful link below.

click here

If you can track the brew ratio (weight of coffee / weight of shot) It provides a more consistent way to compare shots.

As to why your shots are suddenly generating more crema, as coffeenoobie pointed out, every batch of beans is different (even the same blend from the same roaster). If your enjoying the shots your pulling, don't worry too much about the crema vs. liquid ratio, just enjoy. :)

 
- Randy
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DeanOK
Senior Member
DeanOK
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 650
Location: OK
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: QM Vetrano 2B
Grinder: Vario W
Posted Tue Dec 25, 2012, 4:15pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

RomeoMike Said:

Do you have a scale to weigh your shot? I had similar questions about the volume of liquid versus crema in my shots and was turned on to the very helpful link below.

click here

If you can track the brew ratio (weight of coffee / weight of shot) It provides a more consistent way to compare shots.

As to why your shots are suddenly generating more crema, as coffeenoobie pointed out, every batch of beans is different (even the same blend from the same roaster). If your enjoying the shots your pulling, don't worry too much about the crema vs. liquid ratio, just enjoy. :)

Posted December 25, 2012 link

Yep... have a vraio W ... I am using about 18 grams in the portafilter. I brewed another shot since my original post and it it was way too much water volume using the same grinder settings that i was using earlier. Turned the grinder back down and everything is back normal... I don't know what was happening earlier. Happened several times.  The worst thing is how much coffee I wasted dialing the grinder in twice. I had shots that were so far off I had to just pour them down the drain.
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boyscout
Senior Member


Joined: 29 Dec 2009
Posts: 405
Location: Toronto
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Tue Jan 1, 2013, 10:26am
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

Dean, is it possible your mysteriously-behaving coffee was TOO fresh?  Most beans need to rest for a few days after roasting (from three to as much as ten days for some coffees).  As the beans rest, their oils congeal a bit (won't help choke your machine so readily) and they de-gas, releasing CO2 (crema won't be over-foamy).  Did you notice if your "thicker" crema collapsed more quickly than usual?  That would be a sign of over-gassy beans.

Freezing does little or no damage to the taste of many (most?) coffees.  My main coffee source is inconveniently located, so I routinely buy weeks' worth of beans at a time, let them rest in the original high-quality vented roasters bag until ten days after roasting day, and then freeze them, still in the original unopened bag.  Unfrozen is better, but certainly not by miles, maybe only by inches.  A whole lotta people would not notice the difference.

Hope this helps.
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DeanOK
Senior Member
DeanOK
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 650
Location: OK
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: QM Vetrano 2B
Grinder: Vario W
Posted Tue Jan 1, 2013, 12:33pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

boyscout Said:

Dean, is it possible your mysteriously-behaving coffee was TOO fresh?  

Posted January 1, 2013 link

Possibly so. It was a new batch but I have never had any other batches do that. I am still on that same batch and it is no longer frothing up like that.
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alantelfer
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Sep 2012
Posts: 9
Location: uk
Expertise: Professional

Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 4:25pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

i work for a coffee roaster and we regually use beans straight from roaster after cooling. if you by fresh roasted beans there is no need to freeze them keep them in cool place if unopened. once opend beans will go deterate after a two days like a food product. if they are ground the will deterate after 20 mins so only grind as you need to and only keep beans in hopper for two days.
we give our coffee a four month use by date but some roasters in europe give it a year.
you need to get heat into handles and group head they must be hot or that will effect the creme. 18gr is far to much you should be looking at 7gr for single shot and 14 for double. if you getting to much water in dose you grinder is set to course.
extraction time for espresso should be 22/24 secs. once you have grinder set to dispence 7gr single shot time your extraction for 22/24 secs. if quicker adjust your grinder to a finer setting.i think it's always better to set extraction time using
a double shot handle. cleaning group and back flushing  is also inportant for good espresso. see my post on the backflush
thread.
hope this helps
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frank828
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Feb 2011
Posts: 581
Location: Los Angeles
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: GS3
Grinder: RoburE, Kenia
Vac Pot: Hario
Drip: Brazen, CCD, Aeropress, V60,...
Roaster: Behmor, Air Crazy
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 4:33pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

alantelfer Said:

i work for a coffee roaster and we regually use beans straight from roaster after cooling.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

why?

alantelfer Said:

we give our coffee a four month use by date but some roasters in europe give it a year.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

wow...have you tried using four month old beans for espresso?  or even one month old beans?


alantelfer Said:

18gr is far to much you should be looking at 7gr for single shot and 14 for double.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

why do you feel 18grams is far too much?  is this recommendation only for the coffee you roast?  i regularly dose 18grams at home and dose 19-21grams at the shop.  many roasters also recommend much higher doses than 14grams.
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Coffeenoobie
Senior Member
Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3,015
Location: PNW
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 5:03pm
Subject: Re: Suddenly the crema is much thicker and lighter...why?
 

in the PNW the doubles are often 20g plus.

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

My coffee treasure map...
Click Here (maps.google.com)

Oscar trick out: http://s156.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231
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