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What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > What's the best...  
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__________
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 907
Location: .
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Machine now fixed ;o)
Grinder: None
Vac Pot: None
Drip: None
Roaster: None
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 8:12am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

jwoodyu Said:

How priggish a statement that is.  Your saying the collective wisdom of the membership is completely inferior to your opinion of what ever a “proper” machine is.



The only opinion you have offered so far in this thread is that your opinion is superior and failed to offer any particulars regarding features, functions or specific models to consider as requested in the OP.

Perhaps if we work hard someday the “great unwashed” and the OP will attain a level of understanding great enough to warrant a meaningful response from you. Until then we will just have to be content in our inferiority

Posted October 26, 2012 link

There aren't any machines that I know of in the OP's specified price range that I could suggest.  Over that price range yes there are. Personally, I'd go for the La Spaziale Vivaldi, but there's no point in suggesting it. Others are free to suggest what they think are suitable machines to fit the OP's criteria.  The OP is getting a range of opinions which hopefully will inform him of what to choose to do.  

One of his options, as he said - in fact it was a decision at the time - is to stick with what he has for now, and I agreed with him.

You do not seem to have understood that bit.

(edited for typo)
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JasonBrandtLewis
Senior Member
JasonBrandtLewis
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Posts: 6,398
Location: Berkeley, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -...
Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: CCD, Chemex
Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 9:27am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

majorzx3 Said:

I think you forget the then wholy grail of double boilers the Reneka Techno.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

No, I didn't forget.  I only know of one person who has a Reneka and loves it, and only then after he modified it (and I didn't know that at the time I was looking).  Plus -- even so -- a) I didn't know anyone who owned one at the time I was doing my research; b) it was above my price range; c) it required a 20A circuit, which I did not have available at the time; and d) I used to own a truly excellent French automobile (it lasted over 275,000 miles), and didn't want to press my luck!

 
A morning without coffee is sleep . . .
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emradguy
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emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,124
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4 x2, VDD...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 9:42am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

Wow, I thought this thread was getting hot yesterday afternoon!  Now, I'm pretty sure my PC will overheat if I look at it again...lol

 
.
Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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JasonBrandtLewis
Senior Member
JasonBrandtLewis
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Posts: 6,398
Location: Berkeley, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -...
Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: CCD, Chemex
Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 9:50am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

__________ Said:

A wise decision.  Skip the "prosumers" until you have the space/cash/enthusiasm for a proper machine.  You would not regret it.

Posted October 25, 2012 link

Just out of curiosity, what is a "proper machine"?  Or, phrased more "properly," what do you consider a "proper machine"?  And are you suggesting that the Rancilio Siliva is not a "proper machine"?

__________ Said:

The OP is looking for a range of views to help inform his own decision making.  His basic question is not capable of an objective answer, only subjective opinion.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

As are most questions asked on this site.

Not trying to give you $#|+, just trying to understand . . .

 
A morning without coffee is sleep . . .
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russel
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russel
Joined: 12 Mar 2010
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Location: Los Angeles
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Conti Princess 2grp, GS/3...
Grinder: Super Caimanos x2, Forte BG,...
Drip: V60, Kalita Wave, Clever,...
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 8:56pm
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

__________ Said:

Well, that's just your opinion.  And it is just that.  Don't tell me that my equally held opinion is "wrong" just because it doesn't chime with your own.

The OP is looking for a range of views to help inform his own decision making.  His basic question is not capable of an objective answer, only subjective opinion.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

Maybe I should elaborate.  I think that a lot of the discussion here and in a lot of other threads puts too much emphasis on the machinesat the expense of  actually making and drinking coffee.  I think it's unhealthy for the home coffee community at large to suggest that it is necessary to spending $2000+ on an espresso machine to someone upgrading from what is, certainly from a  technically stand point, an entry level machine, and more so to the other people in a similar position who are clearly reading this thread and to those who will read this thread in the future.  Someone with an SBDU does not need to save up over %400 of the cost of their previous machine in order purchase a tool that they can then use to learn how to make and taste espresso.  Telling people to do this marginalizes and obscures the real matter at hand, which is making espresso, enjoying espresso, and learning to make better espresso that you can enjoy even more.  Perpetuating the notion that good and capable tools are only available at $2000+ is not only wrong, it is irresponsible.  It distorts the values of the coffee community, cheapens the discourse, and retards the quality of coffee being made.

I don't like using analogies, but I feel that this is similar to members of a photography forum telling low end point and shoot owner that they really should be saving their pennies for a full frame DSLR because, you know, thats what Pros use to make professional images and they really do capture the best photos.  That is not good advice.  Neither is setting the bar for a capable espresso machine at $2000+ or at light commercial grade only.

On a related matter:

I'm sorry to single you out Bud, I'm think I have been a little testy with you in the past and that probably wasn't called for, but you have been very active in the last couple of months posting a very large amount of what I would call "paper knowledge" and I think that it highlights the problem with the ever expanding upper edge of the "prosumer" segment and with how those machines are discussed here.  It's an uphill battle for me to empathize with your situation because I live in a market saturated with cheap used equipement, but when you have to buy new, things do get expensive fast and decisions start to feel really monumental.  However, it just doesn't seem reasonable that you have forum-ed yourself into seriously considering the "value" of a $2200 Alex Duetto II without ever having owned (not tested or tried out) a non SBDU machine.  And you said it yourself, the Silvia was an uphill battle with you wife/peers, as was the Mazzer.  What is it about the quality of the information floating around this place that makes this possible?  I know first hand how much time, attention, and money can be wasted pursuing incremental "improvements" to your gear instead of focusing on making and tasting coffee.  I think that the gastronomic component of coffee is really getting lost, and an over abundance of second hand opinions and white paper information are mostly to blame.

To seasoned members and probably a mod or two, I know that this is the usual eb and flow of this place and that this type of discussion never dies.  It just seems that more and more of the high end of the prosumer machines are starting to encroach on the price point of light commercial, which kicks off a value comparison that is easy to indulge in but in which it is very difficult to develop an informed and experienced opinion.
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duke_goulden
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Joined: 27 Sep 2007
Posts: 14
Location: OK
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rancilio Epoca
Grinder: Nuova Simonelli MDX
Posted Fri Oct 26, 2012, 10:46pm
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

Sorry if this has already been addressed, but used machines are an incredible deal if you are patient (and a little handy). I bought my first machine and grinder for $375 total, you know what they were? A La Cimbali Junior (old style) and Junior grinder along with knockbox and other accessories. I thought it was fun learning how to clean up the machine and get it into tip top shape, and I saved $3k or so :) Now I've got a Nuova Simonelli MDX grinder and a 2 group Rancilio Epoca (running through a 5000watt 220v transformer :D) that I found for $700. Yeah you have to replace the burrs (still haven't with the MDX) and you have to descale/restore them, BUT THESE THINGS ARE BUILT TOUGH, it takes a lot to really ruin one. Anyway there's my opinion, but above all just buy something you enjoy. Espresso is about the craft of making it, and the flavors you enjoy, not about dosing exactly 18g, tamping exactly 30lbs, timing/weighing the resulting shots...blahblahblah
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qualin
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qualin
Joined: 30 Jun 2012
Posts: 654
Location: Calgary, AB
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto 3
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Elect. Type A
Vac Pot: Looking to buy
Drip: Manual
Roaster: Considering?
Posted Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:49am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

russel Said:

I think that a lot of the discussion here and in a lot of other threads puts too much emphasis on the machines at the expense of actually making and drinking coffee.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

russel Said:

I think that the gastronomic component of coffee is really getting lost, and an over abundance of second hand opinions and white paper information are mostly to blame.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

Well, before I start, I should mention that this is the "Espresso Machines" forum, which is about Espresso machines. :-) Maybe not so much about coffee itself. You are right in that this forum is not the one which people should
be focusing on. Obviously, you know that getting the equipment is just the start of the journey down the road to making an espresso. That's why there are four other forums on here which are dedicated to the discussion of
coffee and techniques. If there isn't as much traffic there as you'd like, perhaps it wouldn't be a bad idea for forum members to start directing people to those forums before the discussion of a machine is even relevant?

Look, here's what I will do from now on. I will not state any more opinions nor supply any recommendations about equipment I do not own or have not owned. If you feel that I am not qualified or knowledgeable enough to
help someone out, I respect that opinion and I apologize. I was just trying to take the load off. However, If I do find articles and reviews about equipment, I'll gladly spend a bit of my time to do a bit of research and
share what I have found with other people, but I'll leave it at that. That's not so bad, now is it?

I'm willing to spend a bit of my own time rehashing the knowledge and experience which I've learned by myself. It's a good learning tool for me to recite my knowledge and if there's something I remembered wrong, I don't
mind being corrected on it. I wish I could say that I have years of experience under my belt, but I don't. I only pulled my first shot back in June, but have been consuming espresso-based drinks for decades.

russel Said:

Someone with an SBDU does not need to save up over %400 of the cost of their previous machine in order purchase a tool that they can then use to learn how to make and taste espresso.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

Agreed again. I guess I should use another analogy. I've been building computers for people for 22 years. I've been doing private consulting on an off for many years. Like anything, an espresso machine is a commodity
item like a computer. Yes, they have different functions, but they also have a laundry list of components which are optional, some mandatory. What I'm alluding to is that the first thing I ask someone when they want to
buy a computer is, "What are you using it for and what is your budget?" .. Of course, I've met numerous people who have been convinced that if they want to buy a computer which "Won't go obsolete", they need to
spend $5000. They come to me and find out that a computer that is $1000 will do the job quite nicely. That is because I find out what they need it for and recommend the best selection of components which will provide
them the best experience. Believe it or not, espresso machines really compare closely to that experience. The only difference is that one is used for making coffee while the other one can be used to buy coffee. :-)

When the user of the computer becomes more demanding of the machine, they'll want more power and with that power comes cost. Suddenly, they want a webcam, or they want a Blu-Ray burner, or they want a large
solid state drive.. suddenly, the cost of the machine goes from $1000 to $4000 quite quickly... they gasp at the price, but when they do get the machine, they comment on how fast it is.

One of the WORST things I could ever do to one of my clients would to try to sell them something I knew they didn't need. What is the point of selling them a $4000 Xeon-based machine which acts as a portable space heater
and sounds like one when all they want to do is browse the web and read e-mail? I can't even think about ripping off a customer. I would rather lose their business than give them what they "want" as opposed to what they "need".
Are you seeing the parallels here?

We both agree that the user grows with the machine, not the other way around. It works that way with computers, I don't see that being any different. The difference though is that espresso machines don't go obsolete!

My analogy above really applies quite well to the world of any equipment which has multiple grades, feature sets and price ranges.

russel Said:

Perpetuating the notion that good and capable tools are only available at $2000+ is not only wrong, it is irresponsible.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

Fly up here to Calgary and come visit some of the espresso equipment vendors which sell equipment here. Walk into their showroom and start asking questions. There's only two options for some of them, a $850 Rancilio Silvia
or some prosumer HX machine starting out at $2200. They'll convince you that you really don't want the Silvia if you are making more than a few drinks a day. I'm sorry man, but that is a harsh reality. At least for me anyway.
I really honestly wish that there were more show rooms like what they have at Seattle Coffee Gear. It all starts with the people selling the equipment.

From a business standpoint, a vendor would LOVE to sell me on a nice expensive machine, just as much as the person at Best Buy would like to sell me a $3000 Macbook Air so he can make his commission.
One person I know of spent $3200 on theirs. This was after I swapped out a machine which was worth half as much, but blew the Macbook completely out of the water. Go figure. The sad part is, it'll fail in 2-3 years and
it's not repairable. The point I'm trying to make here? Both machines do exactly the same thing, but in different ways. One is just a lot cheaper. :)  (Sounds familiar?)

I realize that vendors have to keep the lights turned and the heat flowing, so I don't blame them for taking that mentality.

russel Said:

retards the quality of coffee being made.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

So, do you mean that if it requires less skill from the operator to make a great cup of coffee, that makes for a less skilled operator? Do you mean that if an operator has to do less "work" to make a cup of coffee,
that it will reduce the amount of questions being asked by the people in the community and lessen their curiosity about how to _really_ make good coffee? I think it was once mentioned on this forum that people
who are new to the hobby of espresso are hazed. Would you ever go back to using a Silvia if you had to? Do you think that if a Barista manages to master a Silvia to make a great shot, that will give them the ability
to master a large commercial machine faster?

russel Said:

I feel that this is similar to members of a photography forum telling low end point and shoot owner that they really should be saving their pennies for a full frame DSLR

Posted October 26, 2012 link

I have a friend of mine who is a massive photography geek. The problem are people who expect professional results from a low end point and shoot. They want to be able to control depth of field or they want very
granular control of shutter speed, without realizing that their point and shoot can't do that. Of course, they're going to be told to save their pennies. Worse yet, they want to run a photography business using an iPhone.
The whole HX/DB flamewar is probably an excellent example and symptom of an issue plaguing this forum. Some people I've spoken to on this forum and in real life, really don't want to deal with the challenges of operating a
lower end machine, whether it is an espresso machine, a camera or even a computer. They only want the highest end to make things easier, faster or better. As a result, they can become "snobby" in that they believe if you
want to get results that they are getting, you need to do things THEIR way and get whatever they have and that there isn't any other alternative to their line of thinking. I would agree that is the wrong approach.
I should know, I've experienced this on a daily basis in real life with seasoned professionals in the computer industry. Yes, I respect their knowledge and experience, but nothing is ever written in stone. Disagree with these
kinds of people and they'll never let you forget it that you had to learn the "hard" way.

russel Said:

I'm sorry to single you out Bud,

Posted October 26, 2012 link

Well considering that is the second time I've been singled out in this thread, I'm starting to get used to it. Personally, it's starting to irk me because it means most likely I'm probably doing something wrong. Which I probably am.
I've been chewing on this post for the three hours. (Wow!) You know what? All I'm trying to do is just be helpful, offer knowledge when it is wanted or needed and take the load off of people who are tired of replying to endless
posts about the same thing. If you want to fault me for that, go right ahead, but I always ask myself one thing before I even think about hitting that "Submit Reply" button, "Do I have anything worthwhile to contribute?" If I can't
answer that, I don't post. Just standard netiquette I guess.

russel Said:

I'm think I have been a little testy with you in the past and that probably wasn't called for

Posted October 26, 2012 link

That's because you are a seasoned professional who is experienced and knowledgeable. If you came onto computer hardware forums and started doing what I'm doing now, I'd probably be a little testy with you as well.
However, from my point of view, if you knew to recommend nVidia Geforce 680 videocards to serious gamers and took the time to post about it, even though you hadn't ever owned one yourself, that would be one less post
I'd have to worry about. All I have to ask is just please, be patient with me. I'm still learning.

russel Said:

but you have been very active in the last couple of months posting a very large amount of what I would call "paper knowledge"

Posted October 26, 2012 link

The way you are phrasing that, you make that seem like this is a very bad thing and that I should just stop. I didn't think that doing this was necessarily a bad thing, especially in an espresso equipment forum.
If anything, all that I felt I was really doing was spending a bit of my time researching, learning and reposting information which I had found. I agree that it probably would be nice if I had the luxury of owning six different grinders
of various classes, four different lever machines of varying vintages, an HX and DB machine side by side and a collection of tampers so I could offer informed opinions, but that isn't an option for me, or to most people. (Except the
really dedicated coffee geeks, right?)

I'll be happy to do the research, learn more about what is out there and rehash information when asked, but only if it is welcome.

russel Said:

However, it just doesn't seem reasonable that you have forum-ed yourself into seriously considering the "value" of a $2200 Alex Duetto II without ever having owned (not tested or tried out) a non SBDU machine.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

 
Well, maybe I'm a little naive, but I did read the reviews on this machine from this forum and they're all very positive. I did the math and what I worked out made it clear that the price difference isn't as steep as it looks. After I
worked out what money I'd get for selling my Silvia/Rocky, the difference between buying a low end HX machine and the Alex is about $800. Arguably, that extra money is not going to make much of a difference in the cup and I
would agree with you on that. However, what it will do is enable me to have a machine which simply does everything I could ever possibly need or want and comes with the quality to back it up... and I'll only have to buy it once.

After looking at one in person, I knew it was the right machine for me because I believe that it will meet the needs that I THINK I have. I won't lie to you in saying that there is a bit of a want in there. I do see value in spending
the extra money to get these features, even though they're not directly related to getting any better quality in the cup. A double walled chassis won't give me a better cup, but it may improve the overall user experience for me.

russel Said:

It just seems that more and more of the high end of the prosumer machines are starting to encroach on the price point of light commercial,

Posted October 26, 2012 link

I think this is unfortunate. A really decked out espresso machine costs as much as a really nice desktop computer. I can build a killer gaming system for the same price as a Rocket R58. I can build a complete mid-level computer
system for the price of a decent grinder and entry level HX machine. Most people I know spend just as much on their computer as one would on an espresso machine, if not moreso.

russel Said:

which kicks off a value comparison that is easy to indulge in but in which it is very difficult to develop an informed and experienced opinion.

Posted October 26, 2012 link

It's nice to go shopping, what can I say. :-) You are right though, perhaps I have been contributing way too much of my time to giving others who are curious and new to this hobby second-hand information, without providing
my own experiences. The last thing I want to convey is being a "Know-It-All" without actually being one.

 
Garbage In, Garbage Out, for every step of the process. From Beans to grinder, grounds to machine, coffee to cup.
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GVDub
Senior Member


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
Posts: 862
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Londinium I, Arrarex...
Grinder: Gaggia MD85, Dienes Mokka,...
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Abid Clever
Roaster: Behmor 1600+
Posted Sat Oct 27, 2012, 6:55am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

Bud, I'm not Russell, but there are a couple of issues you raise that I'd like to comment on.

For my money, the least important of the classic "4 M's" is "Maccina". All the machine does is deliver hot water at pressure through a cake of finely ground coffee (assuming that the machine is properly functioning and has been well maintained). I've had amazing shots pulled on low-end SBDU machines by people who know what they're doing and undrinkable shots pulled on 5-figure commercial machines by those who don't. Learning beans, grind, dose and prep are what's important. The need for skill, to a large extent, diminishes hugely once you've pushed the "Go" button that starts the pump.

Machines, however, are the easiest part of the equation to talk about — swapping specs and debating the relative merits of where to place this or that component is a time-honored tradition in most gatherings of enthusiasts. Machines are also the easiest to hold forth on when you don't have a lot of practical, hands-on experience, since, especially in the information-rich internet world, you can find downloadable spec sheets, manuals, and glossy pictures of practically everything. Lord know, I'm not innocent of that myself, though I try and keep a check on my tendencies towards pedantry.

You're obviously a hardware-oriented guy, so your mind drifts to the hardware over everything else. But I'm going to hark back to an example that's been used a couple times in this thread - photography. Your friend, who says that you can't get pro results from a point and shoot is, to put it bluntly, full of it. Lot's of great photographers have created amazing images with cameras far less capable than today's point and shoots. Because photography is about the image, not the hardware. Train your eye and your brain to look at the world through a viewfinder and hone your sense of composition and form and you can take incredible photos with a pinhole camera. I've had to opportunity to know some amazing photographers over the years (my mom had a camera repair shop and fixed stuff for people like Minor White and W. Eugene Smith - I used to own one of W. Eugene Smith's old Speed Graphic 4x5 Press Cameras) and the thing they had in common was that they lived with a camera, any camera, glued to they eye. The camera itself was just a tool to capture what their brains perceived.

It's the same with developing skills as a barista. You need to hone the skills that go into what happens before you lock that portafilter into the machine if what you're after is great espresso (or great coffee in general - it doesn't take a lot of equipment to make a great cup of pourover, but it does take skill and knowledge). Until you can bang out the same quality shot, over and over, varying it to bring out different flavor notes as you desire, on the machine that you currently own (assuming, of course, that it meets certain minimum parameters of being able to achieve the right temp and pressure), what purpose, other than having some shiny new bling to stick on your kitchen counter, does upgrading your machine serve?

Just one man's opinion, of course, but I'm a firm believer that it doesn't require top level machines to develop skills. I think that, sometimes, owning the "Big Metal" can actually get in the way of developing skills (observation gained across numerous creative disciplines). Develop your palate, grow your knowledge base, sit back, listen, read, absorb, taste, evaluate, and make sure that you've mastered those basic skills.
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NobbyR
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NobbyR
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2,046
Location: Germany
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Poccino Opus One, Ariete
Grinder: Eureka Mignon Istantaneo
Vac Pot: N/A
Drip: Melitta Linea Unica de Luxe
Roaster: N/A
Posted Sat Oct 27, 2012, 7:01am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

GVDub Said:

..., the least important of the classic "4 M's" is "Maccina" ...

Posted October 27, 2012 link

+1

Or as I like to say: An experienced barista can pull better shots with an entry level machine and a capable grinder than with a high end commercial machine and a crap grinder. Whenever you think of upgrading, check your grinder first. In case of doubt invest your money there.

 
***
"This drink of the Satan is so delicious that it would be a shame to leave it to the infidels." (Pope Clement VIII on coffee, when he was urged to ban the beverage)
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JasonBrandtLewis
Senior Member
JasonBrandtLewis
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Posts: 6,398
Location: Berkeley, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -...
Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: CCD, Chemex
Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Sat Oct 27, 2012, 9:15am
Subject: Re: What's the best prosumer espresso machine?
 

GVDub Said:

For my money, the least important of the classic "4 M's" is "Maccina". All the machine does is deliver hot water at pressure through a cake of finely ground coffee (assuming that the machine is properly functioning and has been well maintained). I've had amazing shots pulled on low-end SBDU machines by people who know what they're doing and undrinkable shots pulled on 5-figure commercial machines by those who don't. Learning beans, grind, dose and prep are what's important. The need for skill, to a large extent, diminishes hugely once you've pushed the "Go" button that starts the pump.

Posted October 27, 2012 link

Agreed!  As I've often posted re: the 4 M's,

JasonBrandtLewis Said:

All four are important.  Nothing is more important than the grinder.

Posted February 27, 2011 link

Or . . . as if often said on HB, "It's the grinder that makes espresso; the espresso machine is just a hot water delivery advice."

GVDub Said:

I'm going to hark back to an example that's been used a couple times in this thread - photography. Your friend, who says that you can't get pro results from a point and shoot is, to put it bluntly, full of it. Lots of great photographers have created amazing images with cameras far less capable than today's point and shoots. Because photography is about the image, not the hardware. Train your eye and your brain to look at the world through a viewfinder and hone your sense of composition and form and you can take incredible photos with a pinhole camera.

Posted October 27, 2012 link

Darned good analogy!  I used to shoot photographs for the magazines I wrote for, and was far from a professional.  But the best shot I ever took (for publication) was with my first 35mm SLR, the cheapest little Pentax there was.  Today, I have a Canon EOS 35mm film SLR and an EOS Digital.  Routinely, I take what I think are pretty damned good pictures, and many are (IMHO) excellent action shots.  (My daughters both jump horses in competitions, and I shoot pics of everyone from our barn.)  But the action shots are taken with the DSLR when it is simply in "point-and-shoot" mode, and many are better than the "pros" who are hired to cover the event!

Talking about the machine is more important than talking about tamping, but . . . ;^)

Cheers,
Jason

 
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