When I am pouring the grind from the grinder to the basket I shake the basket(& portafilter) from side to side to level things out, I also give the basket a bit of a bash to try and break up any clumps - this is pre-tamp so I assume I am not breaking any 'seal' but am I wrong?
If this is your only method of distribution, you might have a problem with the grounds only getting to the right and left side of the basket, not all around. That would cause some channeling.
soad_x83 Said:
My tamper is 50mm which is a little too small for the basket, the tamper is convex.
I'd suggest you get a good, properly sized (hah, nearly impossible thanks to DeLonghi) metal flat-bottomed tamper. Even though I have a nice Reg Barber for 58mm baskets, the $7 RSVP 50mm (actually 2 inches/~51mm) still sits next to my Ec155. It fits nicely in 607706, but some of the smaller baskets that slant inward might have issues (usually solvable by updosing) with the basket sides hitting it.
soad_x83 Said:
I find it hard to do analysis of the puck, the top the puck is a little concave with with a few pin-sized holes, I would say there is not much evidence of side-channelling but the underneath of the puck is mostly the same colour but has a dark ring around the outside. Is that abnormal?
The holes might suggest channeling through the center, which I would attribute to the convex tamper. Someone more experienced with those should give their opinion though...
soad_x83 Said:
I realise I should be asking these questions in a more appropriate thread...
Has anyone had luck with grind and dose with an unpressurized single basket (Delonghi bar basket) not the single that came with the machine? Not a huge deal. Worst case I will use a pressurized basket. 7 Grams even at a finder grind seems to just break the puck and under extract leaving a mess and a watery shot.
I've only attempted ~10g singles, and then perhaps only 10 times. I think the general opinions on the boards would prefer the flavor of a 16-18g double over a single, and if one were to pull a single it would use something along the lines of 12g. That also depends on what you mean by "single" and "double..."
Do those 7 grams fill up the entire basket? By only suggestion would be try updosing a bit and see how you like the results. Perhaps try a finer grind and maybe a heavier tamp as well.
Keep experimenting, I'm sure you will find something that works for you.
~Nick
There's a big difference between drinking coffee to wake up and waking up to drink coffee.
(The parentheses won't go away! Seriously, that's why this is here...)
soad_x83 Said:
I have the 606348 basket which holds about 10g as far as I can tell (Click Here (www.amazon.com)) - I've not had much luck with it, but nearly every espresso I've ever pulled is with the 607706 and I'm a total noob so nothing I say can be taken seriously! I think Nickfrogger says he bought it on the first page, maybe he has some thoughts on it.
My go-to basket is 607706 (holds about 21g max) but I do have both the 606348 and the 606349 baskets. Let me do some tinkering--I actually have extra coffee I need to use up for once--and we'll see what happens.
soad_x83 Said:
I also found this http://www.kennethballard.com/?p=463 which says with minor mods we may have some luck with la pavoni millenium double basket - and from what I see la pavoni do an equivalant single basket too so maybe that would work? What are peoples experiences with the la pavoni baskets over the delonghi ones? I might buy one for the sake of it.
If you do, that would be a really beneficial addition to this thread. I've seen a lot of questions about it and not many answers, so if you get one sent your direction a write-up on the conversion and results would be excellent!
~Nick
There's a big difference between drinking coffee to wake up and waking up to drink coffee.
7 grams is barely covering the bottom of the single basket. even less when tampes with a finer grind. I will try 10g and see what happens. I have found that doubles produce next to no crema when used with a single. I'll try tonight or tomorrow and see which gives better results.
Ok, so I just did a little comparison of the two baskets. First of all, on review I do not have 606349, but a basket nearly (if not completely) identical to 606534 (actually Krups MS-0907163, it very well could be the same basket with the way things are distributed to these companies).
I admit my presuppositions going into the test was that the Krups would have underextraction at the top, where the basket has full diameter, and overextraction at the bottom, where it funnels to probably half the surface area. I know it isn't that comprehensive, I think I'll do another trial sometime including all the baskets I have, but here are the results:
Stuff: Lelit PL53 grinder/Delonghi Ec155/RSVP "50mm" tamper For the sake of consistency, I ground the coffee, preheated the cup and ran the pump until the light turned off, and began the shot when the light came back on rather than my usual temp surfing process.
606534 look alike Minimum full dose: 11.5g Max dose: 15.5g Shot 1 (15g, 1.5oz): ~34 seconds. Very rich, not bitter; really chocolatey Shot 2 (directly dosed ~12g, 1oz): ~28 seconds, rich and bright, well balanced
I know it's only 4 shots, but looking back my other shots with these baskets support the conclusion: the funneled basket is more forgiving and yields a more balanced shot. I wouldn't go below a 11.5g dose; if that is too intense, pull it a little longer.
Hope that helps some, ~Nick
There's a big difference between drinking coffee to wake up and waking up to drink coffee.
If you do, that would be a really beneficial addition to this thread. I've seen a lot of questions about it and not many answers, so if you get one sent your direction a write-up on the conversion and results would be excellent!
Thanks to soad_x83 for linking to the article on my blog regarding the La Pavoni basket. I've yet to post a follow-up to that article, and I need to, but here's the gist of it. Since the article was posted, I've bought a grinder (Breville Smart Grinder) and tamper (Coffee Complements 51mm), as well as an AirScape to store the beans. I use of the La Pavoni basket for all my espresso shots, and the results are far better than the pressurized basket that comes standard with the EC155. On first uses of it, I noticed that the espresso had a much more defined flavor to it, and the coffee's flavor comes through much better in the milk in a latte as well.
I've not tried the single basket for the Millennium, but I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work either. Like the double it should just be a bit of elbow grease to get the rim flattened enough.
Thanks for the info Nickfrogger! MJW do you not have any channelling issues with dosing 11g into the basket? I tried 11g last night - my kitchen got most of it, not much went in the glass!
Oops, sorry to cause you to do that! I've been working on this for more than two months now, so it's been a lot of trials and adjustments for me.
I assume you're grinding a lot finer to match the lower dose. My 11 grams is measured in the basket. The flow that I get, out of the bottom of the basket, is as thin as possible without breaking into drops.
I've experienced small squirts but it's hard to say what caused them, and these days squirts are rare. I try to keep shaking and tapping to a minimum but when I do it I still get a good flow. I use a very light tamp, probably 6 - 7 pounds.
I don't mean to imply that small doses are better; I believe it's a continuum, and you can use different parameters to manipulate various aspects of the extraction process.
Oops, sorry to cause you to do that! I've been working on this for more than two months now, so it's been a lot of trials and adjustments for me.
I assume you're grinding a lot finer to match the lower dose. My 11 grams is measured in the basket. The flow that I get, out of the bottom of the basket, is as thin as possible without breaking into drops.
I've experienced small squirts but it's hard to say what caused them, and these days squirts are rare. I try to keep shaking and tapping to a minimum but when I do it I still get a good flow. I use a very light tamp, probably 6 - 7 pounds.
I don't mean to imply that small doses are better; I believe it's a continuum, and you can use different parameters to manipulate various aspects of the extraction process.
:) Thanks for the info! No worries about the mess, it's not your fault in any way, it's not my first 'squirter' and won't be the last I suspect! I tried it because I am totally new to espresso and experimenting with all variables - too many at once probably. I asked about side channelling because, as Nickfrogger said earlier, a potential consequence of under-dosing the basket may be side channelling - and given the basket is so much bigger then you are dosing, if it were a big problem with EC155/607706 basket you would have experienced it/be experiencing it. Of course I understand that just because you aren't experiencing side channelling it doesn't mean that I am not (if indeed I am)....
If you do, that would be a really beneficial addition to this thread. I've seen a lot of questions about it and not many answers, so if you get one sent your direction a write-up on the conversion and results would be excellent!
I've ordered the basket from fairfax coffee (http://www.fairfaxcoffee.com/), I will post some pics and a comparison to the delonghi baskets I have when it arrives. Thanks brandishwar for the blog!
Even though I have a nice Reg Barber for 58mm baskets, the $7 RSVP 50mm (actually 2 inches/~51mm) still sits next to my Ec155.
Sadly I can't get hold of the RSVP tamper in the UK atm. I've ordered the la pavoni plastic tamper from fairfax coffee to see how that works. A plastic tamper is probably not a very good idea but as I'm now starting to get Mrs. soad a bit upset about my immediate spending. Let's just say I don't have a good track record for 'the best economical practices' in my hobbies :)
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