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La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
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slybarman
Senior Member
slybarman
Joined: 3 Nov 2011
Posts: 366
Location: usa
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Nuova Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Mon Oct 8, 2012, 6:32am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Rob55 Said:

I looked at "parts" on 1st-Line for the Cuadra. They show a 15A fuse. I have had mine apart and the only glass style fuse I seen was in the plug. That one is T6.3AL 250V which is nothing like a 15A. I wonder if this adresses my problem with blown fuses... perhaps some others have had the problem and they recommend to go to the bigger fuse. I guess I need to call them and see if I can get any info.

Posted October 8, 2012 link

Assuming the same wattage heating element, 6.6 amp on 250 would be comparable to 15 amp on 110 (250/110 x 6.6 = 15). In any case, I would say you need to get with Jim and get to the bottom of the issue. Swapping blown fuses is treating the symptom and not the problem.
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1stline
Senior Member
1stline
Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Posts: 499
Location: Freehold, NJ USA
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Undisclosed
Grinder: Indisclosed
Vac Pot: Bodum Electric
Drip: None
Roaster: None
Posted Mon Oct 8, 2012, 12:53pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Rob55 Said:

Hi guys .. been awhile since i stopped in and it took some time to catch up on all I hadn't read since last I was here.

A quick question... is anyone else besides me having trouble with the fuse under the power plug blowing out? If so do you just keep replacing it or have you found a fix? This morning I had my 8th fuse blow out since I got the machine in Dec. After the first one went I keep spares on hand.... sadly last time I got 3 and about a week ago I had to replace one and the next one went out about 30 minutes later and so no more spares and I had to break out my Lelit to have my morning fix. These fuse are slow blow and cost about $3.50 a pop.... so I have about 25 bucks in fuses in 9 months... and its getting old. I am glad I kept the Lelit as a back up. :-)

Posted October 7, 2012 link

Hi Rob,

As I mentioned over the phone about 1-2 weeks ago, this fuse at the inlet of the electrical power cord is more of protective feature for 'dirty' electricity. In other words, it will blow for poor power coming in, and from my understanding, it has nothing to do with power coming out. Alternatively, it is made to protect the internal electrical components from 'dirty' electricity, but it is not 100% foolproof. If these fuse keeps blowing, it means

a) there are electrical spikes in the electricity from the electric company, or
b) there are electrical spikes coming from other appliances on the same circuit, or
c) there is a possibility of too much voltage coming into the machine.

I strongly suggest getting a surge suppressor of 1080 joules or higher to protect the fuse and machine. Please note that this has not been a widespread problem. We had to replace the first fuse on about 5 machines. After this, I can not remember anyone else going through multiple fuses, and this raises my suspicion on the electrical supply.

In addition, please check the voltage several times throughout a day, month, and week to see if there are changes. I just had an emergency light blow out in our warehouse and the reason was that the electric company was feeding 290 volts where we are only supposed to get 277 volts. And, only one of 8 emergency lights blew.

If you can, please keep me informed via email on your progress of checking the electricity.

 
Sincerely,
Jim Piccinich
Business Partner
1st-line Equipment, LLC
www.1st-line.com

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slybarman
Senior Member
slybarman
Joined: 3 Nov 2011
Posts: 366
Location: usa
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Nuova Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Mon Oct 8, 2012, 2:20pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Jim - what voltage will blow the fuse?

I assume he would need a surge suppressor of a sufficiently low clamping voltage to have any effect.
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Rob55
Senior Member
Rob55
Joined: 6 Oct 2010
Posts: 112
Location: Canton, Ohio
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Nuova Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Cuisinart
Posted Mon Oct 8, 2012, 8:45pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Thanks Jim for the reply. I am not sure who you mentioned it to on the phone 2 weeks ago, but I can assure you it wasn't me. I think I was the first one who had a fuse go and I did call you guys back then.(in Dec) Whoever I spoke to there had me take the machine apart ...both sides, top, back, water reservoir, frame for reservoir.... and heck I can't remember what all. I happen to notice the fuse by accident... it's kind of hard to see. I called back and the guy told me it didn't have a fuse. Anyhow he checked and decided yea it had a fuse. You guys didn't replace it .... I did. But you also took care of me (and thanks for that).

I am not sure what else might be on that circuit, but I will try and check. No idea what a joule is ...guess I will see what I can find out .... also I wouldn't have the first clue how much voltage there is coming from the outlet.... or how to check it or even what to check it with... suffice to say I know absolutely zip about electricity. I am sure someone I know will understand....if I can figure out who to ask.

Meanwhile I will not use it until I find out something definitive. Besides ... the Lelit has been making some super shots (plugged right where the Cuadra was plugged in) I will say that in the 20 years I have lived here nothing else has had a problem working perfectly from this outlet.

Thanks for all the info though. Hopefully I can find someone that knows what it all means.
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t3chiman
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Dec 2011
Posts: 19
Location: Chicago
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Cuadra
Grinder: hand
Drip: Brazen
Posted Tue Oct 9, 2012, 3:22am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Rob55 Said:

Thanks for all the info though. Hopefully I can find someone that knows what it all means.

Posted October 8, 2012 link

It means that your serious, potentially hazardous, problem is not being properly addressed.

A fuse blows due to current in excess of its rating passing through it for a specified period of time. A fuse responds only to current, not to (changes in) voltage--which is what terms like "surge" or a "spike" refer to. So putting suppressor devices in the circuit will do nothing to alleviate your current-related problem.

What to do? First, stop replacing fuses. You gotta find out what's drawing all that current. The typical culprits are crossed wires and defective components. Because coffee makers are pretty simple electrically--heating coil, switch, bang-bang controller--I would suspect first an intermittent short involving internal wiring. Since you have burned so many fuses, there will be some smoke and soot damage internally by this time. Open the unit and take a good look around.

The unit is working otherwise, so the problem is most likely something trivial. If it turns out that it isn't, it's time to get some warranty work done.

Hope this helps.
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Rob55
Senior Member
Rob55
Joined: 6 Oct 2010
Posts: 112
Location: Canton, Ohio
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Nuova Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Cuisinart
Posted Tue Oct 9, 2012, 9:07am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

I have done a little research trying to follow some of the above advice. To keep from boring any of you to death... I will just state one of the things I have found...

A surge protector does no good at all if its not on a grounded line. Since my house was built in 1948 the only places it has grounded service is in the few places I have updated since I lived here. The kitchen one where I use the Cuadra is not one of the ones updated. I took the cover off and had a look... the wiring is ancient so I suspect it might be the culprit as suggested by t3chiman. A workaround I found says to use a GFI .. I happen to have a new one of those, but I am not sure there is room to fit it in there. However I probably can put that in myself... problem is the wiring may be brittle after all this time and it doesn't look like they left ANY spare wire to work with. There is also a light switch connected in with it. This means I probably won't attempt it .... lol
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t3chiman
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Dec 2011
Posts: 19
Location: Chicago
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Cuadra
Grinder: hand
Drip: Brazen
Posted Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:53pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

To reiterate and clarify:

You have a problem  with excess current. Overvoltage ("surge") protection devices are not relevant in this context, and do no good.

The symptoms suggest that an intermittent wiring short circuit is responsible. I meant that  wires internal to the machine are shorted, not internal to the wall. Open up the machine and trace the wires from the plug all the way through the motor, switches, lights, thermostats, etc.. There's gotta be some scorching or melted insulation somewhere. Find it and clean it up.

A simple volt-ohmmeter is a big help in chasing down short circuits; they are about 7 dollars at Harbor Freight these days.

It would be a good idea to update the machine's wall outlet to 3 wire. Attaching the green wire to the outlet box is the usual way to do it. In any event, it's better than using a cheater plug adapter, or cutting off the ground prong.

GFCI is not called for.

Hope this helps.
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Rob55
Senior Member
Rob55
Joined: 6 Oct 2010
Posts: 112
Location: Canton, Ohio
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Nuova Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Cuisinart
Posted Wed Oct 10, 2012, 10:45am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

I went ahead and replaced the receptacle anyhow...with a GFI ...its close to the sink and should be GFI. There is also a light switch covered by the same plate and I replaced it too while I was at it.

I wouldn't even consider cutting the ground prong and I wasn't using the cheater adapter. The receptacle would take the 3 prong even though its not wired for the 3rd one to do any good. Also got a tester to check ACV. Need to read how it works yet.

I took apart my machine and inspected the wiring. Couldn't find and loose wires or burnt wires.... however I did find this part click here on the right side in this picture or opposite the wire to have that chamber smoked over a bit. Now I don't know if this part is causing the problem or if the problem has caused this part to look that way. Will replacing it fix my problem or will the new one look like that as soon as I blow a fuse or 2.

Side note... the light switch and receptacle were on 2 different circuits... no other major appliances were on the same circuit as the espresso maker.

and thank you t3chiman I needed the clarification.. I did read it wrong and think you meant with my wiring rather then internal to the machine.
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cruizie
Senior Member


Joined: 16 May 2012
Posts: 48
Location: Ohio
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: La Nuovo Era Cuadra
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Roaster: Poppery
Posted Wed Oct 10, 2012, 12:54pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Just received and am starting to install my new thermometer. Were there any variances to the instructions for the Cuadra? So excited to see how much it helps me!
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t3chiman
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Dec 2011
Posts: 19
Location: Chicago
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Cuadra
Grinder: hand
Drip: Brazen
Posted Wed Oct 10, 2012, 1:13pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra Owners Thread
 

Rob55 Said:

however I did find this part click here on the right side in this picture or opposite the wire to have that chamber smoked over a bit. Now I don't know if this part is causing the problem or if the problem has caused this part to look that way. Will replacing it fix my problem or will the new one look like that as soon as I blow a fuse or 2.

Posted October 10, 2012 link

The answer is: Who knows? Relay contacts do stick occasionally; if one contact is not breaking before the other is making, that's a short circuit right there. No way to tell at a distance. If the machine were out of warranty, I would get a new relay, see if makes a difference. The FINDER - 40.61.8.240.0000 - POWER RELAY is 10 bucks at Newark. In warranty, I'd just ask the dealer to send me a new board. If it fixes the problem, fine. If  not, more mutual effort is called for.
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