calblacksmith Moderator Joined: 25 Nov 2007 Posts: 5,652 Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A. Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: ECM Veneziano A1 Grinder: Many different commercial Vac Pot: 40s era Silex Drip: Milita, Bunn&Curtis... Roaster: Cast iron pan, gas burner
Posted Thu Jun 28, 2012, 5:51am Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
My normal dose is 18g in a double basket. I have put in as much as 22 g but that is not the norm for me. I found that I really do not get any use out of my triple basket and just stay with my double. Try it both ways and see which you prefer, either would be OK but I tend to see 18 g in a triple basket as being under dosed. YMMV!
In real life, my name is Wayne P.
Feed the newbs, starve the trolls and above all enjoy what you drink!
emradguy Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2011 Posts: 1,698 Location: Houston Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II Grinder: MacapM4T, Macap M4, OE Lido,... Drip: Espro press; Aeropress Roaster: internet
Posted Thu Jun 28, 2012, 9:41am Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
^ +1
I do use my triple routinely, and I dose at 20g, but there's room to dose closer to 22g without frank overdosing. I would stick with the double for 18g. If you do and feel you're overdosing, you might want to look into splurging for a VST...or better yet...see how you like other doses of Black Cat.
j123 Senior Member Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Posts: 56 Location: US Expertise: Just starting
Posted Thu Jun 28, 2012, 4:51pm Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
thank you for the info. I have a standard silvia double basket. The only way I can fit 18 grams in is if I partially fill the basket, tap lightly on the counter to distribute, fill more and tap against the counter before tamping.
emradguy Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2011 Posts: 1,698 Location: Houston Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II Grinder: MacapM4T, Macap M4, OE Lido,... Drip: Espro press; Aeropress Roaster: internet
Posted Fri Jun 29, 2012, 9:00am Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
some people do that, yeah. I was taught that method when I went to my Barista training course at Klatch Roasting...and I had a Silvia at the time. I don't use it anymore as I find that for my equipment it leads to an overdosed shot that I don't like. I would recommend you take "18g" as a suggestion and adjust dose to your machine/equipment and taste.
There are lots of ways to dose, and once you find one that works for you, the best thing to do is keep it consistent. My method is to simply fill my basket as centered as possible, and then use a N, S, E, W -esque finger sweep to level and distribute the grinds (trying very hard not to apply any downward pressure while I sweep), then I tamp, just until I feel the grinds compressed (about 20-30 lbs). I do it this way every time, and for me (again, I'm using a triple basket w a naked pf) I get 20 g every time I weigh it (which is only occasionally to make sure I haven't lost my touch). I adjusting my grind as necessary to vary shot timing. YMMV, however.
I highly suggest reading Randy Glass's (frcn) easy guide to better espresso (article 12 under "how-to"), on his website www.espressomyespresso.com
j123 Senior Member Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Posts: 56 Location: US Expertise: Just starting
Posted Sun Jul 1, 2012, 2:16pm Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
after some additional experimentation, there is just no way to jam 18 grams into the standard silvia double basket. No amount of knocking, tamping or distributing was able to get the puck low enough to leave any space between the screen. If this is the case, what basket are people using?
I've had some success at the 15 gram level, but the espresso seems to be missing a certain "brightness"
emradguy Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2011 Posts: 1,698 Location: Houston Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II Grinder: MacapM4T, Macap M4, OE Lido,... Drip: Espro press; Aeropress Roaster: internet
Posted Mon Jul 2, 2012, 2:56pm Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
are you that glued to using Black Cat? Nothing wrong with that if you are, but I'm just wondering. Me, it's not my favorite, but some people really love it. I can't tell you what others use for dosing black cat in a silvia, but I use Strada baskets (which are very similar to VST and they fit my rancilio oem pf handles...and my silvia when I still had it.
germantownrob Senior Member Joined: 2 Dec 2007 Posts: 2,011 Location: Philadelphia Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Duetto 3, A Dead Oscar Grinder: Vario-W, Preciso w/Esatto,... Drip: Brazen Roaster: Diedrich IR-1, HT B
Posted Mon Jul 2, 2012, 4:23pm Subject: Re: 18 grams in a double, tripple or other basket?
j123 Said:
after some additional experimentation, there is just no way to jam 18 grams into the standard silvia double basket. No amount of knocking, tamping or distributing was able to get the puck low enough to leave any space between the screen. If this is the case, what basket are people using?
I've had some success at the 15 gram level, but the espresso seems to be missing a certain "brightness"
Different "double baskets" from different manufactures (in some cases from the same manufacture) will hold varying amounts of grinds. Different beans and the different fineness of grinds they require can alter the max amount that will fit in the same baskets. I have a ton of different baskets from different manufactures and out of these I have my favorites, what I use is usually defined by the bean or blend I am using. Right now I am on a HQ triple basket kick, this thing will do 21g and can be overdosed to 26g no problem with my machine for many beans however they only make a 14g basket and a triple. VSTs are nice but you need multiple sizes to change the dose by more then 2g. The 18g VST sounds like a good match for your blackcat beans although their may be some less expensive options if money is tight.
There is an option with your stock basket, decrease the amount of liquid you extract. So if 15-16g is the max your stock basket will hold comfortably then just pull less then two ounces (not sure the specs Blackcat wants in extraction to the 18g overdose) or better yet use a scale to weight your extractions to be more precise. This is what I did with every triple basket I had before the HQ since most could barley handle much more then 22.5g and this is not much of an overdose for a full triple.
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