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The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
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MarkPrince
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Posted Fri Mar 19, 2010, 4:35pm
Subject: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

So today I got some further details on a project that my very good friend Bill Crossland is working on. Some of what was discussed has to stay close to the chest (for design, invention, marketing, pricing reasons), so I hope everyone will understand that, but today there's a lot more I found out that can be discussed.

For those of you who don't know, Bill Crossland was the head of US operations for La Marzocco, and the chief guy on the GS/3 project. That is the last mention I'll make of the GS/3 because Bill doesn't want comparisons drawn between his new project and that one, and feels the two are for two completely different markets. Bill left La Marzocco in Oct, 2008, and decided to focus his new career on getting Crossland Coffee off the ground, and working on a new market for him - design of consumer machines.

Very few people knew about this work, but with SCAA around the corner Bill is hoping to show off the prototype at the show (this is really up in the air btw - he's not sure yet if he can do it) - I figure the time is right to get some details into the public.

I call this machine a potential game changer for four reasons.

Pricing is to be competitive. We're not talking the plus side of $5K here - we're talking the minus side, and if things work out for Bill, way down on the minus side. The competitive pricing is in relation to the scope of consumer HX machines. This is all I can say about pricing right now.

This machine will feature pressure profiling, but much more exciting is the design is to be  temperature profiling as well. This is still iffy, as there are issues. It is, however, designed also to be very temperature stable and that works in a brand new way (ie, not a copy or alteration of current temp stability methods on other machines). Temperature profiling is possible, and a goal for the machine.

The machine is designed in the US, for the US (and Canadian) market, with US/Canada power in mind. It is not being manufactured in in Italy (or the US), and that is part of the process that makes it so competitive in pricing and technology.

Lastly, Bill has a huge surprise for the entire grouphead design. I can't say any more at this point other than to say its going to really alter what everything thinks a grouphead should be (and should be made out of) to the point where it's going to require some re-educating on everyones part. Preconceived notions about grouphead design might have to go out the window.

I'm hoping Bill will join the conversation here to talk more about the machine in the coming months. Me, this is the most excited I've been about espresso machine design and technology since first laying eyes on the GS/3 prototype back in 2005. (oops, I guess I mentioned that machine once more - but that's it! :))

Mark

 
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TheMummaFamily
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Posted Fri Mar 19, 2010, 4:46pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Wow, awesome Mark, thanks.  I cannot wait to hear and see more!!  

Are you allowed to tell us how much you have seen?  Have you seen drawings or prototypes of parts, etc?  Did you give any input or do any testing on the design?  Is there a working/mostly working prototype now?

 
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MarkPrince
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Posted Fri Mar 19, 2010, 4:47pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

I've seen a CAD mockup. I've been in touch with Bill since he left LM, discussing the project a few times, offering whatever input I could offer.

Bill has a working prototype in his kitchen, making espresso every day.

EDIT - I discussed with Bill him coming up to Vancouver (after SCAA), and us holding an open testing / evaluation session and discussion, having people drop by the Lab to check the prototype out, and broadcasting it all on Ustream.

Mark

 
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jammin
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Posted Fri Mar 19, 2010, 4:53pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Very exciting indeed.

Curious to what the timeframe will be until they are available for purchase

 
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canon
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 10:38am
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Mark....this is exciting news.  I am a big fan of Bill Crossland.  He always was extremely generous with his time in responding to questions about the GS3 Paddle before I bought mine and he wasn't even working for LM.  This is a clear indication of good character in my opinion..

Is there a timeframe that Bill hopes to start talking about his machine and the sales of it?   I am currently collecting all the information on a Speedster and plan to make a purchase before the price increase.  However I would love to know about Bill's machine before making the final decision on the Speedster.

Please keep us posted.

Bob
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TimEggers
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 12:00pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Mark I can't believe I missed this thread (thank goodness you posted via Twitter).  This is all incredibly exciting and I too hope Bob will join this discussion with updates and any information he can divulge.  Persoanlly I'd love to hear the story, inspiration and ideas behind the Crossland project.

Finally, incredibly relieved that hopefully the GS/3 experience can be a model from which this project can benefit.

 
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wideasleep1
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 4:56pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Perhaps we can discuss the grouphead in more detail, while maintaining patentable protections? When you say 'material' do you mean to say the material itself maintains the thermal stability, or is it the 'saturated' group that dictates its stability? It would seem that neither of the current thinking allows for both pressure and temp profiling WHILE simultaneously giving thermal intra and intershot stability...does the Crossland Project appear to resolve this?
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Bob_McBob
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 6:15pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Is this going to be on the market soon, or are we going to be hearing about it for several more years before it's available, like the GS/3?  I suppose it's also worth noting that the GS/3 was supposed to sell for $4500...

I'm happy to put any upgrade thoughts on hold for the time being, but not if it's just a pipe dream right now.

Also, post more info ;)

 
Chris
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MarkPrince
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 6:21pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

canon Said:

Mark....this is exciting news.  I am a big fan of Bill Crossland.  He always was extremely generous with his time in responding to questions about the GS3 Paddle before I bought mine and he wasn't even working for LM.  This is a clear indication of good character in my opinion..

Is there a timeframe that Bill hopes to start talking about his machine and the sales of it?   I am currently collecting all the information on a Speedster and plan to make a purchase before the price increase.  However I would love to know about Bill's machine before making the final decision on the Speedster.

Posted March 20, 2010 link

At this point, based on what I talked to Bill about, I don't think the Speedster and the Crossland Espresso Machine should be considered in the same class. Bill is doing this machine very specifically for he consumer marketplace, and that includes a) volume of production, b) shots per hour, c) weight, d) size, e) durability, f) pricepoint, g) UL certification, etc etc. This will, from what I can tell, be a machine to produce 4-8 shots a day on (althought I am sure it can bang out shot after shot when pressed, from time to time), whereas Kee's machine is designed 100% commercial, and is only limited by having a single group - otherwise, it is a fully commercial espresso machine, capable of handling commercial volume.

One thing Bill and I talked about is, if the machine becomes successful, he'd love to work with Kees to do a "special edition" of the machine, using Kees' design and styling skills, and put a wrapper around Bill's technology. Long distance dream, but Bill and Kees have a good relationship.

Another thing is that Bill has two patents on what he's doing, and honestly, I fully expect some commercial machine makers to come on board and license his patents for future use in commercial machines - this is why I think this machine is a game changer (or one reason out of several).

For showing - Bill is planning on attending SCAA and wants  show the machine there, but it is still not 100% sure. After that, he and I were talking about him coming up to Vancouver, doing an open Lab session that we'd also ustream.

Mark

 
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MarkPrince
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
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Posted Sat Mar 20, 2010, 6:23pm
Subject: Re: The Crossland Espresso Machine Project - potential game changer
 

Bob_McBob Said:

Is this going to be on the market soon, or are we going to be hearing about it for several more years before it's available, like the GS/3?  I suppose it's also worth noting that the GS/3 was supposed to sell for $4500...

Posted March 20, 2010 link

One big difference - this isn't La Marzocco. One of the biggest knocks I can make against LM is they engineer some fantastic ideas, then take FOREVER to bring to market.

Bill is now a one man operation, with a mortgage to pay. This machine is his mortgage, a lot more. It is his current career. No one benefits more from the machine coming to market as soon as possible than Bill.

Based on that, I think you'll see this machine come to market a lot quicker - it has to for Bill's financial health (I'm assuming).

Mark

 
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