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Alex Duetto II Fumes

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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Alex Duetto II...

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jwoodyu
Senior Member

Joined: 31 Dec 2010
Posts: 705
Location: Michigan
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Allex Duetto II
Grinder: Mazzer Major
Roaster: Poppery

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 7:04am Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

tastyhouse Said: I am sure most people put porcelain cups up there which means they wouldn't see anything collecting. My point is that I'm sure people are having the issue and just not realizing it. Posted February 24, 2012 link Now that is a scary thought. Depending on the nature of the stuff being left in the cups you have a potential product liability / safety / recall issue.

You know those people that want to tell you how to raise your kids but have none of their own? That is how i feel when someone with a kitchen appliance tells me how the merits or dis-merits of my machine or how to use it.

Viernes
Senior Member

Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 33
Location: Spain
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II
Grinder: Compak K10 Fresh
Roaster: Quest M3

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 7:07am Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

This is the glue? used to joint the insulation material http://s15.postimage.org/c5l5rhl7f/DSC02250.jpg

Metatron
Senior Member

Joined: 10 Nov 2011
Posts: 47
Location: Calgary, Canada
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: BDB900
Grinder: Vario

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 7:46am
Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

Viernes Said:

This is the glue? used to joint the insulation material

http://s15.postimage.org/c5l5rhl7f/DSC02250.jpg

Posted February 25, 2012 link

The insulation material seems to be some sort of plastic foam. I would guess that may out gas at high temps. The steam boiler boiler runs at 250F or so which is in the area where many plastics start to break down. And the glue may be problematic also. Really, the insulation should be something good for 200 deg C or more. It can be held on with tie wraps or metal wire rather than glue. Someone didn't do their homework.

If anyone is thinking of letting this "bake off" in their kitchen for days or weeks, give your head a shake. Plastics can emit very toxic and carcinogenic fumes when they break down. You are probably OK as the temperatures MAY be too low to release really bad stuff but you never know. If there are kids around, you are taking a risk with their future health as well as your own.

MTmama
Senior Member

Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 49
Location: Bozeman, MT
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto
Grinder: Super Jolly

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 7:57am
Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

Metatron Said:

Posted February 25, 2012 link

My concerns exactly. I'm not in a panic, but will certainly look at removing that insulation when my machine arrives. With five little ones (youngest is an infant) I certainly don't want chemicals off gassing in our home.

JKelly
Senior Member

Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 1
Location: Calgary
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 1:01pm
Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

Metatron Said:

Posted February 25, 2012 link

Greetings. I've been following this story with great interest. Here's a chart showing the temperature limits of some common insulation materials:

Click Here (www.engineeringtoolbox.com)click here

"Rubber" / "plastic" based insulations (Polystyrene, Polyurethane, Elastomeric foam) all have high temperature ranges that seem unsuitable for this application. I'm not an expert it looks like a potentially serious oversight on behalf of the manufacturer. I'd be looking for some kind of formal response from Izzo. They should be able to provide product data sheets for the insulation (and adhesives) they're using in their assembly. Letting it "burn off" is definitely not advisable.

James

glcoffee
Senior Member

Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 67
Location: Los Angeles, CA & Taiwan
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Izzo Alex II
Grinder: Vario
Drip: Hario V60

Posted Sat Feb 25, 2012, 10:45pm Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

Is this an issue on the Alex II's (non-db)?

“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.” C.S. Lewis, The World's Last Night ------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------ I am Taiwanese.

jwoodyu
Senior Member

Joined: 31 Dec 2010
Posts: 705
Location: Michigan
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Allex Duetto II
Grinder: Mazzer Major
Roaster: Poppery

Posted Sun Feb 26, 2012, 5:45am Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

glcoffee Said: Is this an issue on the Alex II's (non-db)? Posted February 25, 2012 link I thought the boiler on the HX had been insulated for sor time. Maybe it's a different material and or adhesive. It would be cool if some could check there's. There two purchased by members recently I believe.

You know those people that want to tell you how to raise your kids but have none of their own? That is how i feel when someone with a kitchen appliance tells me how the merits or dis-merits of my machine or how to use it.

sazerac
Senior Member

Joined: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 29
Location: San Diego
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Electronic type...
Drip: Bodum Santos

Posted Sun Feb 26, 2012, 11:00am Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

I am expecting my Duetto II on Wednesday and am wondering what I should do? Do I even open up the box and wait until some definitive solution comes up? I've e-mailed CC to see what they suggest.

MTmama
Senior Member

Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 49
Location: Bozeman, MT
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto
Grinder: Super Jolly

Posted Sun Feb 26, 2012, 11:13am
Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

sazerac Said:

I am expecting my Duetto II on Wednesday and am wondering what I should do? Do I even open up the box and wait until some definitive solution comes up? I've e-mailed CC to see what they suggest.

Posted February 26, 2012 link

Mine arrives tomorrow. Logic says it is either the adhesive(that would be my guess) OR the actual insulation around the steam boiler. Duettos used to NOT have insulated boilers, but this was added to help conserve energy. I highly doubt this improves any function of the machine. I have waited quite some time for my Duetto and will not be sending it back due to an insulation issue. Now, if it had been a hardware issue I would consider it.

I am planning on removing the insulation and adhesive before even turning it on. IF, in the future it is found that the insulation adds to the machine's performance I'll find a stable insulation that can handle the heat and wrap the boiler myself.

Overall, kind of a pain in the butt on a $2000+ machine. It would be nice to have a firm answer from CC/Izzo that acknowledges the issue. But, my desire for good espresso far outweighs a little hassle like removing some insulation.

sazerac
Senior Member

Joined: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 29
Location: San Diego
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Electronic type...
Drip: Bodum Santos

Posted Sun Feb 26, 2012, 11:26am Subject: Re: Alex Duetto II Fumes

Yes I do want my espresso as soon as possible since i am without my machine, but the thought of having to work on a new machine does not sit well. Besides removing the insulation which makes sense. how do you know what is best to remove glue and how do you ensure you have removed all of it? That's why I think I am leaning to hear from CC before i open box. I would think Izzo has the responsibility of telling customers what to do. Besides one of the reasons i bought from CC is their terrific customer service. That's why I'm sure CC will come up with a proper solution. Yes, I'm a trusting person.

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