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Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
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D4F
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
Posts: 1,878
Location: USA
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Classic PID
Grinder: Preciso
Posted Wed Jan 2, 2013, 5:54pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

If that does not make any sense, read about the controller and then read its instruction manual about alarms, note 13.  I am using this 2362 and use both alarms and PID.

Click Here (www.auberins.com)

Similar on the 1512 which has one PID function and one alarm and would do both boiler and steam.

 
D4F also at
http://www.gaggiausersgroup.com/
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Burner0000
Senior Member


Joined: 28 Jul 2011
Posts: 1,011
Location: Cambridge, Ontario Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, VFA Expres...
Grinder: Macap MX/VFA N1464/Kyocera...
Drip: Manual Drip, French Press
Roaster: Behmor 1600 / Sonofresco
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 9:13am
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

I just read the instructions.  So the PID function takes care of the brew temp. I can just fine tune the range if I want to.  The On/Off and alarm funstions I can set the temps to allow for steam.  The limit control can be set in case the temp takes off (dry boiler). Looking at the diagram in the instructions. Wiring for steam I would just bypass both thermostats with a 2nd SSR.  Right?

I am looking for a 1/32 PID with these functions.
•Model: SYL-1512A looks like what I want minus display temp.
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D4F
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
Posts: 1,878
Location: USA
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Classic PID
Grinder: Preciso
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 12:14pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

Yes, PID does brew/idle and alarm high and low cycle steam.  If you use 2 SSRs then you bypass or eliminate the tstats.  You keep the OEM limit.  Of course a dry boiler cooks the element before the limit control stops the process with or without the PID.  Water is needed to cool the element.

Just to reiterate, the brew SSR is standard DC input which will come from the PID SSR circuit, but the second, steam, SSR needs to be AC input - AC output.

Click Here (www.ebay.com)

Sounds like you understand correctly.  Now to collect supplies :)

In the Auber kit including steam, some internal tweaks are made to the parameters and a DC output is generated, from the PIDs internal switching supply, to the alarm so be careful if you read the kit instructions.  I do not believe that it uses a second SSR.

 
D4F also at
http://www.gaggiausersgroup.com/
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Burner0000
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Joined: 28 Jul 2011
Posts: 1,011
Location: Cambridge, Ontario Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, VFA Expres...
Grinder: Macap MX/VFA N1464/Kyocera...
Drip: Manual Drip, French Press
Roaster: Behmor 1600 / Sonofresco
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 1:37pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

D4F Said:

In the Auber kit including steam, some internal tweaks are made to the parameters and a DC output is generated, from the PIDs internal switching supply, to the alarm so be careful if you read the kit instructions.  I do not believe that it uses a second SSR.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

Do you know the model of the PID that comes with the Auber /Steam kit?  
I assume you mean that that PID has a built in 10A SSR that handles brew and the addition SSR for steam.


For Example:
Click Here
This one under OUTPUT MODE Relay Contact:    3A at 250VAC           SSR: 8V DC, 30 mA
                                                                >>>Internal Relay<<< >>>External SSR<<<
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D4F
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
Posts: 1,878
Location: USA
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Classic PID
Grinder: Preciso
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 2:11pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

I believe the Auber kit has a proprietary version of the 1512, but it could be a different controller.  It is not sold apart from the Kit, I asked early on in an email to Suyi at Auber.  It has some paramaters programmed and fixed and from what I have seen by searching, it has a DC output to the single SSR from the SSR output and another DC output from the alarm.  Perhaps an internal added module or a different 1/32 din PID.

The internal SSRs are not adequate for most espresso machines being at only 10amps.  Most need at least 15 amp and 25 for a cushion.  The PID output to the external SSR is very small amperage AC or DC.  All of the amperage is on the load side of the SSR.  Internal SSR does not really help for espresso machine heaters.

The one that you show has specs similar to the Auber.  The SSR output, not an internal SSR, is 8v and 30 mA.  DC SSR takes input from the PID at about 3-4v up to 32v DC and low mAmps.  The contact relay is the alarm side which acts as a switch for AC or DC and the AC limits shown.  I used a cell phone charger and habe about 5v DC through the alarm contacts.

 
D4F also at
http://www.gaggiausersgroup.com/
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tasseloff
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Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 229
Location: Sherbrooke, Canada
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sun Jan 6, 2013, 9:35am
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

How are things going? Did you order the PID already? I also went through a PID install recently as D4F mentionned earlier. It can be confusing at first but its a fun and easy project if you take your time. I'm also in Canada and didn't have too much trouble ordering most pieces online.
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Burner0000
Senior Member


Joined: 28 Jul 2011
Posts: 1,011
Location: Cambridge, Ontario Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, VFA Expres...
Grinder: Macap MX/VFA N1464/Kyocera...
Drip: Manual Drip, French Press
Roaster: Behmor 1600 / Sonofresco
Posted Sun Jan 6, 2013, 10:00am
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

No.. I gotta deal with a totalled car first..  Once that's done I may just go with the Auber retrofit seeing as how it just comes ready to install.  Next project will be to find a way to add pressure adjust on the fly. I know theres a way to do it and that will gove me MAX control over pulling shots. :D
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tasseloff
Senior Member


Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 229
Location: Sherbrooke, Canada
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sun Jan 6, 2013, 4:30pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

Well, sorry about your car!
About the Auber kit, its solid enough and simple enough to install. The only caveat is concerning the steam control (if you buy the cheaper kit) but as you've read its possible to by-pass it with a second SSR or a power adapter. I didn't get as far as adjusting the pressure, but I'm running out of time these days for projects. Keep us updated on your progress! :)
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D4F
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
Posts: 1,878
Location: USA
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Classic PID
Grinder: Preciso
Posted Sun Jan 6, 2013, 5:01pm
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

Burner0000 Said:

Next project will be to find a way to add pressure adjust on the fly. I know theres a way to do it and that will gove me MAX control over pulling shots. :D

Posted January 6, 2013 link

Click Here (coffeegeek.com)

http://www.samplett.com/node/21

http://coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/machinemods/580666

The specific dimmer, since many do not work

http://coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/machines/580293

 
D4F also at
http://www.gaggiausersgroup.com/
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Burner0000
Senior Member


Joined: 28 Jul 2011
Posts: 1,011
Location: Cambridge, Ontario Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, VFA Expres...
Grinder: Macap MX/VFA N1464/Kyocera...
Drip: Manual Drip, French Press
Roaster: Behmor 1600 / Sonofresco
Posted Mon Jan 7, 2013, 5:31am
Subject: Re: Advise on the best PID kit for Silvia V3
 

Can't that harm the pump?

I was thinking of adding a valve somewhere between the pump and the grouphead or moving the OPV durring the pull.
Because the Silvia is a SB machine, wouldn't opening the steam wand reduce brew pressure?
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