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My Appia modding thread (was Automation of HX cooling flush?)
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Discussions > Espresso > Espresso Mods > My Appia modding...  
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ddubick
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Joined: 1 May 2012
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Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
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Espresso: Nuova Simonelli Appia 1Gr
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Posted Mon Jan 7, 2013, 3:51pm
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

I might have failed to mention that this idea was for home use.  While HX's are designed to work at a commercial pace my home pace is quite a bit slower and I just wanted to add accuracy to the flush.

I gave up on the idea of the PID control of the boiler temp and took the sensor out of the boiler.  This machine is pretty new, pressurestat still keeps it in a really tight band.

I ended up installing the sensor at the top of the boiler HX outlet (see pic) and it's 100cm long so it's pretty much sitting in the middle of the HX.  Interesting results watching how the temp fluctuates inside the HX depending on the parameters I set.  I also have to think of a way to work this extra parameter into the algorithm in a useful way, as it seems to be an indication of the temp that will eventually make it's way to the grouphead.

I've been playing with the PID algorithms and I've got it working pretty good.  Takes a little more water and more time than a manual flush but I think it likely makes for a more stable temp.

I really have to take some pictures or video and post some data logs...

I would still appreciate your input DavecUK.

ddubick: appia2.jpg
(Click for larger image)
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StuLouden
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StuLouden
Joined: 6 Feb 2013
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Location: Avon Lake, OH
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Espresso: Nuova Simonelli Appia 1 gr...
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Posted Wed Feb 6, 2013, 2:35pm
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

Well I'm happy to have come across this thread... I too have an Appia 1 gr Vol. and recently been thinking along the lines of what you are doing.

I'm curious to see the data you get from the HX... I'm looking to get a Extech EA15 dual input data logging thermometer to record extraction temps and measure flush techniques to achieve optimal temp for brewing.

Keep up us in the loop, I'm excited to see what you develop.
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ddubick
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Joined: 1 May 2012
Posts: 150
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Nuova Simonelli Appia 1Gr
Grinder: OE Pharos, Macap M5, Nuova...
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Wed Feb 13, 2013, 9:31am
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

Constructed another version of my circuit board with 4 RTD input channels.  Put another sensor in the grouphead after the solenoid to see how much the temps differ after the hot and cold sides mix on their way to the portafilter.  Wish I had a scace thermofilter handy to see how temp at the puck corresponds.

Got the control panel and display pretty much how I want it (turns out there's a cutout in the appia's front panel that looks like it's for an lcd, just had to cut the front).  Just want to work on what and how I'm displaying the data.  I actually found a better set of stick on buttons that I ordered from China, might take a while to get here with Chinese New Year's.

I've ordered some aurelia gicleurs to play around with the thermosyphon flow and see how I can tweak the temps (inspired from the recent Oscar/Musica restrictor activity).

Is it insanity to take a knife to the front of a perfectly good commercial machine or is it geekdom? ;)

ddubick: appia3.jpg
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Coffeenoobie
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Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
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Espresso: N S Oscar
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Posted Wed Feb 13, 2013, 9:44am
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

I love it.  A temp read out of the group head would make me most happy.

 
Coffeenoobie

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ddubick
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Joined: 1 May 2012
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Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
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Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Wed Feb 13, 2013, 9:49am
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

Oscar doesn't have any ports on the grouphead does it?  Might be able to drill and tap but that's getting truly crazy.
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Coffeenoobie
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Posted Wed Feb 13, 2013, 3:55pm
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

It is the same head as Musica and I saw the group head drilled for a probe on Musica.  Plindy said there looked like there was a spot for it to be drilled but I don't see where that is. You can look at the photos of mine.

http://s156.beta.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231#

 
Coffeenoobie

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ddubick
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Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
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Espresso: Nuova Simonelli Appia 1Gr
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Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Feb 14, 2013, 7:28am
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

Hmm... looking at the pics you took and the diagrams of the grouphead I wonder if you could tee off the expansion valve and put a sensor in there.  Don't know the measurement on the expansion valve or if there's be enough inside diameter inside a tee of that size to accommodate a threaded sensor... but I thought I'd throw the idea out.

If it's a 1/4" thread I'd say it might be possible and from the pics I'd guess it is.
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Coffeenoobie
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Coffeenoobie
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Posted Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:52am
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

I wish there was a good way to get the group head temp I have thought about it often.

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

My coffee treasure map...
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Oscar trick out: http://s156.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231
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ddubick
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Joined: 1 May 2012
Posts: 150
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Nuova Simonelli Appia 1Gr
Grinder: OE Pharos, Macap M5, Nuova...
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Feb 14, 2013, 2:33pm
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

?

I offered that idea as a possible solution for the Oscar/Musica. :)
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Coffeenoobie
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Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3,052
Location: PNW
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Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Thu Feb 14, 2013, 2:38pm
Subject: Re: Automation of HX cooling flush?
 

ddubick Said:

?

I offered that idea as a possible solution for the Oscar/Musica. :)

Posted February 14, 2013 link

Well, maybe I misunderstood your idea.  You are talking about the valve on the left side of the group head right?

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

My coffee treasure map...
Click Here (maps.google.com)

Oscar trick out: http://s156.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231
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