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Espresso: Espresso Mods and Restorations
Rebuilding an Ellimatic

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Discussions > Espresso > Espresso Mods > Rebuilding an...

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mitchellb
Senior Member

Joined: 20 Jul 2007
Posts: 634
Location: Houston, TX
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Isomac Zaffiro
Grinder: Mazzer Major
Drip: Hario Pourover
Roaster: Behmor 1600

Posted Thu Jun 12, 2008, 1:45pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

ohh.. i was under the impression that milk would become sucked into the boiler due to the negative pressure of the vapor lock.. I understand that the anti-syphon valve does that job, but what would be another root cause of opening a steam valve and having it suck liquid in?? (sorry to go off topic notquite..)

kitt2000
Senior Member

Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Posts: 225
Location: nelson, new zealand
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Lambro,
Grinder: Mazzer SJ
Roaster: Gene cafe

Posted Thu Jun 12, 2008, 4:08pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

Hi mitchellb, i remember talkin to you when we both had ellimatics! I'm not 100% sure what causes milk to be sucked back into boiler, and the anti syphon valve i've only seen mentioned in the higher end home machines like wega and cimbali semi-commercial ones as opposed to home machines like isomac , vibiemme etc. I just always try to not leave the wand submersed in the milk for too long when the valve isn't open, and always give it a good blow out at the end. Maybe someone more knowledgable can let us know how frequently milk gets sucked back into the boiler on home machines

notquitemac
Senior Member

Joined: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 16
Location: Ithaca, NY
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: NS ellimatic

Posted Thu Jun 12, 2008, 9:33pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

Hardly off-topic; given how much brownish milk-copper-scale crap is in the boiler and steam line, any method of preventing this in the future is extremely invited discussion... Parts have actually so far been easy and no more to expensive to acquire then parts for newer machines; everything I've needed so far has been stocked by the US distributor of NS parts, and the sales people have been helpful. I think I've decided to not install a vacuum breaker, at least for the time being. The machine was easy to take apart if I want to add it in the future, and I don't want to introduce any new variables for diagnosing any problems after I put it all back together. Since I'll never be in a hurry while using this machine, keeping the steam valve open during startup is a minor inconvenience at most. As far as milk getting sucked into the steam wand is concerned, the explanation I've heard is that if you close the valve with the wand submerged in milk, some residue will be left behind. As the machine cools, vacuum builds up inside the boiler/steam circuit. When you next open the valve, this vacuum will be exposed to atmosphere, pulling air and the milk back up the circuit, so it seems like a vacuum breaker would fix this problem.

kitt2000
Senior Member

Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Posts: 225
Location: nelson, new zealand
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Lambro,
Grinder: Mazzer SJ
Roaster: Gene cafe

Posted Thu Jun 12, 2008, 9:43pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

ohhh, i see now.I stand corrected and apologies to mitchellb.I can see how that would work now, i always give my steam wand a good wipe and blow out any redidual milk anyway.It's a good habit to get into.

Posted Thu Jun 12, 2008, 11:02pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

no apologies are necessary, i think the best thing to do is to blow you steam wand out very well after steaming milk, but i think a vacuum breaker would fix the problem as well as an anti-syphon valve. what i did after i had cleaned out me elli was simply purged the boiler of all the steam every time i turned it off and left the steam knob fully open.. when i went back to the machine the next time to turn it on i closed the knob after steam started blowing out.. I do understand your reservations in installing the breaker at this time, but i was just throwing it out there.. there are lots of reasons my astra is bigger/better/badder than the elli, but in the end it is really the same machine in principle, and the vacuum breaker is the chief reason that it's better/more convenient to use.. Give us some links to the tear down pictures..

notquitemac
Senior Member

Joined: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 16
Location: Ithaca, NY
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: NS ellimatic

Posted Fri Jun 13, 2008, 8:02am Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

Is there any way to post images inline on this forum? The Elli, as she sat before I grabbed any wrenches. Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Removed the pump and tubing to the boiler: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Removed more tubing; part of the steam line, and the OPV. Click Here (img.photobucket.com) All the tubing removed from the machine: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Then, on to removing the boiler: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Splitting the boiler in half was a pain; the gasket is still stuck to one of the flanges, on the right: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) If your Ellimatic's steam is smelly, here's a possible explanation: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) The bottom half of the boiler, after removing the heating coil and scrubbing with a wire brush and some soap: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) The husk of the machine: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Necessary anal-retentive parts bins; I wouldn't attempt this otherwise: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) The whole mess on the bench: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Next I'm going to finish cleaning the inside of the boiler, try to remove the heat exchanger, and start cleaning/descaling the plumbing.

Posted Fri Jun 13, 2008, 9:43am Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

incidentally .. get a nuova simonelli beach portafilter and cut the bottom off of the elli one.. it's too small to fit a decent sized basket.. i can't believe i forgot to tell you that.. the beach one has threads and you can test the group pressure that way

mhoy
Senior Member

Joined: 4 Feb 2008
Posts: 183
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Roaster: HotTop KN-8828D

Posted Fri Jun 13, 2008, 9:49am Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

You can easily attach a file via the "Attach File" when posting. Look for the "Browse" button. However it's limited in size and limited to one file per post. Easy enough to use, but not good enough for those times you need a BIG picture. Multiple pictures becomes a pain... Mark

mhoy
Senior Member

Joined: 4 Feb 2008
Posts: 183
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Roaster: HotTop KN-8828D

Posted Fri Jun 13, 2008, 9:54am Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

Ugh, the boiler picture is disturbing. Wouldn't want to drink stuff from there before it was cleaned up. Your work bench and parts sorting would have made finding a couple of bolts I misplaced much simpler. My sorting method when I rebuilt my Elektra T1 consisted of numerous digital pictures and a pile of stuff.... Mark (Click for larger image)

notquitemac
Senior Member

Joined: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 16
Location: Ithaca, NY
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: NS ellimatic

Posted Fri Jun 27, 2008, 3:47pm Subject: Re: Rebuilding (to some extent) an Ellimatic - need your help and your photos!

Cleanliness is a virtue. After citric acid baths, sandpaper, scotch-brite, wire brushing, a trip to the belt sander (gaskets get virtually welded on after not being replaced for ~20 years), and a lot of washing, the boiler is as clean as its going to get: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Unfortunately I couldn't get the heat exchanged out (slightly warped part of the boiler trying), so the top isn't as clean as would be ideal: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) I did manage to get the heater coil out, which cleaned up nicely: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) I gave all the copper parts a bath in citric acid solution and a good scrubbing; acid etching is so shiny! Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Some new gaskets/parts from NS: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Then I reassembled the whole thing, which was entirely uneventful. Pics of it back together: Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Click Here (img.photobucket.com) Its working as well as it was before the break-down, so that's a good sign at least. I've been gradually leeching the air out of the boiler for the last hour or two, and its finally starting to make decent steam. I'm hoping that air in the boiler fooling the pressurestat is what's making the lack of steam and not something thermo/pressure-stat related. I pulled one trial shot so far, before decent steam was produced; it was thin and had virtually no crema, but its promising so far! Any alternate theories as to the lack of steam/weak shot are welcomed. I'm going to pull another trial shot soon and see what I can coax out of the beast.

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