Our Valued Sponsor
OpinionsConsumer ReviewsGuides and How TosCoffeeGeek ReviewsResourcesForums
Espresso: Grinders - Espresso
Help me choose a baratza
Donate to Coffee Kids
Coffee Kids works with farming communities around the world, improving lives. Donate today.
www.coffeekids.org
 
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered  
Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Discussions > Espresso > Grinders -... > Help me choose a...  
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
showing page 1 of 4 last page next page
Author Messages
MikePriz
Senior Member


Joined: 6 Nov 2006
Posts: 13
Location: San Francisco
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 4:08am
Subject: Help me choose a baratza
 

I'm just getting back into espresso and bought a gaggia baby, thinking I'd be satisfied with my hario slim until I could save up for a $500+ grinder, but it's much more tiring than I ought to manually grind for espresso with the hario, so I want to get a grinder now. Problem is I don't have the funds for a prosumer grinder. My question is if I really need it.

I'm very satisfied with the shots I manage with the hario, so I'm strictly looking for convenience.

This led me to two possibilities.

Baratza precisio or encore.
The precisio is already stretching my budget, so the Vario is out of the question.

If I like the quality of shots pulled with my hario, will I be able to taste a largely noticeable difference with the precisio? And if not, will the difference in shot quality between the encore and precisio be very noticeable? I understand that after calibration, the encore can grind fine enough for espresso, but won't have much room for minor adjustments. I'm ok with this, as I'll adjust with tamp and dose. I don't foresee myself upgrading my gaggia for a while.

So I guess to summarize, will shots pulled with the encore be on oar with the hario, and would the precisio make a major improvement in shot quality over the encore on an entry level machine like the gaggia.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
boar_d_laze
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 1,069
Location: Monrovia, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: La Cimbali M21 DT/1 Junior...
Grinder: Ceado E92; "Bunnzilla"
Vac Pot: Royal Coffee Maker
Drip: Chemex + Kone; Espro Press
Roaster: USRC Sample Roaster
Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 7:34am
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

MikePriz Said:

Will the difference in shot quality between the encore and precisio be very noticeable?

Posted January 16, 2014 link

Yes.  Sort of.  It doesn't really work like that.  The Encore grinds fine enough for espresso, but is not "espresso-adequate" in the sense that it doesn't give you enough adjustment to tweak the grind in that fine enough range.  It's also not sufficiently consistent.  

I understand that after calibration, the encore can grind fine enough for espresso, but won't have much room for minor adjustments. I'm ok with this, as I'll adjust with tamp and dose.

You understand it intellectually, but not from a technique standpoint.  It doesn't work like that.  Or, at least not well.  No one can tweak by tamp well enough to control for fairly subtle effects like the changes required when beans age, for instance.

So I guess to summarize, will shots pulled with the encore be on oar with the hario

Probably not.

Would the precisio make a major improvement in shot quality over the encore on an entry level machine like the gaggia.

Depends on how well you use the Gaggia.  The Gaggia's largest failing is with temp.  If you have that under control, it's good enough to reveal whatever's going on -- good or bad -- with grinders better than either.  If you can't temp very well, your coffee will taste so bitter or sour it will make it that much harder to dial in any grinder, BUT -- no silver lining! -- you'll still taste the flaws of a bad grind.

Mark Prince, who knows a lot about this stuff, loves the Preciso.  Me, less.  The Preciso is "espresso adequate" not "espresso good."  I hear the LeLit PL53, at a couple of bucks less than the Preciso, is better for "espresso only" and within that context grinds about as well as the Vario -- minus a lot of the convenience and dosing magic.  But I'm just passing on gossip, and haven't actually used a LeLit.

Good luck,
BDL
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
NobbyR
Senior Member
NobbyR
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2,021
Location: Germany
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Poccino Opus One, Ariete
Grinder: Eureka Mignon Istantaneo
Vac Pot: N/A
Drip: Melitta Linea Unica de Luxe
Roaster: N/A
Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 8:06am
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

The Baratza Preciso is widely regarded as the entry level electric grinder for espresso, because not only is it capable of grinding fine enough for espresso, but it also has enough steps to dial it it correctly.

 
***
"This drink of the Satan is so delicious that it would be a shame to leave it to the infidels." (Pope Clement VIII on coffee, when he was urged to ban the beverage)
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
dwRK
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Sep 2013
Posts: 92
Location: Houston
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 9:13am
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

i think my baseline would be virtuoso with the preciso burrs...but i'd probably get the lelit and live with the noise.

power drill + hario will be a temporary fix if you already have one.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
moosepucky
Senior Member
moosepucky
Joined: 6 Jun 2009
Posts: 153
Location: USA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Pasquini Livia 90 auto
Grinder: Super Jolly - Forte BG -...
Vac Pot: Cona - Santos
Drip: Bodum - Chemex - Hario -...
Roaster: Hottop KN-8828-B
Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 10:08am
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

Boar_d_Laze put you on the straight and skinny.

I would add that I have used many Baratza grinders over the years including the 2 you are considering.

I am probably more critical than many and would say Preciso would be bottom of your choice options.  I do not use my Preciso for espresso as I have other grinders that perform better for that function.

My suggestion would be to keep using your hand mill for another month and seriously put aside enough for the Preciso with the thought in mind that it can move to be your pour-over/drip/press grinder a year or so down the line when you feel you need a better grinder or when you get a better espresso machine and the shortcomings of the Preciso start to become more evident.
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
MikePriz
Senior Member


Joined: 6 Nov 2006
Posts: 13
Location: San Francisco
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 1:16pm
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

I've found a used Vario for $300, but I'm a bit skeptical because it's much cheaper than the typical used price. The seller offers a return policy and a 90 day warranty, but I don't think it would fall under Baratza's manufacturer warranty.

What is the reliability of the Varios? Worth a chance?
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
ilVecchio
Senior Member


Joined: 22 Jun 2002
Posts: 179
Location: Tucson Az
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Cremina, Elektra Leva
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Technivorm
Roaster: Hottop
Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 4:07pm
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

Doesn't Baratza sell reconditioned Varios for $370?  You'll need to be patient until one comes up on the site.

Joel
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
MikePriz
Senior Member


Joined: 6 Nov 2006
Posts: 13
Location: San Francisco
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 4:56pm
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

I believe so, but after adding in sales tax and shipping, its closer to $420. The seller that I found doesn't charge sales tax and shipping is only $10, so a $100 difference.

My only concern is if I run into issues with the Vario, how helpful will Baratza be, and if the Vario has any reliability issues that could come up after using it for a while.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
tglodjo
Senior Member
tglodjo
Joined: 16 Oct 2012
Posts: 209
Location: Jackson, TN
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Spaziale Mini Vivaldi II
Grinder: Baratza Vario, Virtuoso
Drip: Wave, V60, Chemex, Clever
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 5:30pm
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

You can get a brand new Vario on eBay with a "Best Offer" option for $350 with free shipping. That's how I got mine and it's been superb. I think one of the sellers is names zoesstuff. Not positive though. Refurbed from Baratza is $360. I've never had to pay sales tax with them, and shipping was only $16, so not too bad.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
MikePriz
Senior Member


Joined: 6 Nov 2006
Posts: 13
Location: San Francisco
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Jan 16, 2014, 5:41pm
Subject: Re: Help me choose a baratza
 

I'm in CA, so guessing tax is required here for Baratza. $250 was originally my max budget, which put me in range of a Preciso, but I figured I can stretch it to $300 if it means I can get a Vario. No way I can stretch it to $350-$470.

Should I stay away from this used option? Its via Amazon's marketplace, and the seller sent me an email that they'll provide a 90 day warranty. Any issues I'm sure I can take up with Amazon if they don't honor this.

I'm mostly worried of potential problems after the 90 days.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
showing page 1 of 4 last page next page
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Discussions > Espresso > Grinders -... > Help me choose a...  
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered     Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
Discussions Quick Jump:
Symbols: New Posts= New Posts since your last visit      No New Posts= No New Posts since last visit     Go to most recent post= Newest post
Forum Rules:
No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards.
No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum.
No SEO style postings will be tolerated. SEO related posts will result in immediate ban from CoffeeGeek.
No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum.
Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards.
Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics.
Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies.
Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies.
Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts.
Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
Cafe Solutions
Commercial sales and service, nationwide installation, equipment leasing options.
www.seattlecoffeegear.com
Home | Opinions | Consumer Reviews | Guides & How Tos | CoffeeGeek Reviews | Resources | Forums | Contact Us
CoffeeGeek.com, CoffeeGeek, and Coffee Geek, along with all associated content & images are copyright ©2000-2014 by Mark Prince, all rights reserved, unless otherwise indicated. Content, code, and images may not be reused without permission. Usage of this website signifies agreement with our Terms and Conditions. (0.26074385643)
Privacy Policy | Copyright Info | Terms and Conditions | CoffeeGeek Advertisers | RSS | Find us on Google+