gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,965 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Thu Aug 12, 2010, 6:13pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
I finally got back to putting the finishing touches on my modded Proline (burrs were swapped couple of years ago) and thought I'd share the results. I've completed one for myself and one for my oldest son so far with one to go for my youngest son.
Lateral runout - moving burr. (This is by far the biggest improvement) The backing plate for the rotating burr is aluminum and either warped or probably just slid thru quality control. Runout was about 40 thousands on each and was corrected on the lathe. This is most likely a common problem on the Proline as shown by the many reports of inconsistent grind.
Radial runout is easily corrected as the screw holes are sloppy enough to allow shifting the burr.
After the surgery the burrs would not zero (actually wouldn't before on one) so 1/16 was removed from the auger( only the aluminum, not the steel shaft) to allow it to set deeper in the gear box. Burrs zeroed fine and showed no sign of misalignment.
The cavity behind the burrs was filled with epoxy and tooled down. This eliminated the holding of old grind.
Grind consistency is vastly improved when viewed with a magnifying glass. Espresso shows less bitters, french press has more detail in the cup while leaving almost no fines.
Mission accomplished.
Grinders I own to compare with: Macap MXP, Pavoni Zip, Bunn LPG (for drip)
Was it worth it? Depends..... I like the look of the Kitchenaid......I like the size...I like the rugged construction.....
I also like to tinker, improve something and most of all I just wanted to see if it would work.
Posted Tue May 3, 2011, 7:49pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
Hey all,
I'm quite late to this party, but I just won a "like new" KA Proline on eBay for super-cheap and am awaiting its arrival. Can anyone offer any new info on this topic? Long-term reports, links to how-to's, etc?
As much as I like to tinker, I would just as soon be willing to hire someone else to do it for me, if such a service were to exist. As it stands I'm just not sure I have the tools, and I'm afraid I'd have to take the grinder over to a machinist or something, anyway. My landlord keeps a shop in the detached garage out back, but I'm not sure what-all he's got out there and I doubt he'd let a tenderfoot like me go stumblin' around with no idea. All I've got in-house are some screwdrivers, wrenches and one electric drill w/ bits & such for hanging stuff, etc, and some bicycle tools.
Espresso-wise I have an old Saeco with a PPF which doesn't require the best grinder in the world, but I'm looking to upgrade to a standard PF soon. Ideally a bottomless "naked" PF. Before I bother I'm hoping to have a grinder that's up to the task, and I have to think that the KA Pro with MM burrs could not only perform, but possible excel... ? And with the solid KA build, it should last a good while, too.
gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,965 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Tue May 3, 2011, 10:24pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
In the process of comparing the new Preciso to a commercial Bunn and the Proline for french press. Rather not comment just yet.
I will speculate that paying someone to perform the upgrades would cost you an arm and a leg. Do the mods suggested in the Kitchenaid handbook and unless, in the future, you are capable of doing the mods yourself, start saving for another grinder.
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 7:28am Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
I don't mean to sound like a dandy with the "hiring" idea. I'm basically just determined to complete this mod, by hook or by crook. I can pick up or borrow a couple tools if need be, but really, what's needed here? Can a low-end electric drill not handle it? I imagine a screw-threading tap isn't very expensive. What else -- a vice? Some kind of shim... My main concern is the precision needed for aligning the screw holes on the MM burrs.
gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,965 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 7:59am Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
If the burr carrier on the auger is warped, which many seem to be be, its necessary to turn it down on a lathe (very important). The rear of the auger will need about 1/4" of material removed in order to zero the burrs which also requires a lathe. The factory did not want the stock burrs to ever touch. A hand drill will work for the burr mounting holes but a drill press is preferable.
It's a fun job but I can't imagine a machine shop doing the metal work for cheap. However, it wouldn't hurt to take the auger in and have an estimate. The mini burrs are ~$50 a set.
Edit: There is some slop in the Mazzer burr holes so alignment of the holes in the mounting plate has to be close but will allow some movement for burr alignment.
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 11:21am Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
So, even if I'm lucky enough to get a spinning carrier that's not warped, a lathe is definitely still necessary for the slimming of the rear of the auger? Is that what you mean btw -- grinding or filing down that 1/4" of material?
Why do we need to cut down the auger anyway, if the MM burrs are actually thinner and need to be shimmed?
I apologize if all this has been covered in the voluminous thread above and on HB. This is why a concise step-by-step should be posted somewhere. Once I receive my KApro and begin this process, I pledge to do my best at generating a step-by-step including before/after pictorial for each step. I work from home, so, yeah -- I'm just enough of a procrastinator that I'd do this kinda thing.
gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,965 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 12:02pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
OriginCharacter Said:
So, even if I'm lucky enough to get a spinning carrier that's not warped, a lathe is definitely still necessary for the slimming of the rear of the auger? Is that what you mean btw -- grinding or filing down that 1/4" of material?
The shoulder of the auger bottoms out before the burrs, stock or Mazzer, touch.
OriginCharacter Said:
I apologize if all this has been covered in the voluminous thread above and on HB. This is why a concise step-by-step should be posted somewhere. Once I receive my KApro and begin this process, I pledge to do my best at generating a step-by-step including before/after pictorial for each step. I work from home, so, yeah -- I'm just enough of a procrastinator that I'd do this kinda thing.
I had almost forget to mention that there is a bevel on the stock burrs that the Mazzers don't have. The burr carrier on the auger has a beveled depression that the stock burrs sit in and this bevel provides positive centering for the stock burrs. It must be cut back straight with something like a Dremel tool for the Mazzer burrs to fit.
I've posted the information in more than one thread here on CG in the past. Not enough people interested to make it worth my while to document it with pictures. You are welcome to have at it.
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 1:07pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
By gar, it shall be done.
Bevel, eh? That's just great. Hopefully there exists some kind of rotary-tool attachment or bit I can just use in my black-n-decker. Low-end dremel-type things aren't too pricey, though.
I guess the lathe is my potential trouble point. My neighbor, a landscaper, is constantly working on his trucks, mowers and gear all the time; he might well have a lathe. If I end up doing anything in his presence, however, my self-consciousness will surely curtail the simultaneous photo project. There's only so much outright geekiness I can bare to expose in person. Behind closed doors I could still muster the before/after shots, though.
As for the shoulder "bottoming" out -- having examined the KA diagram and photos from related posts, I now see what you mean. So the Proline was manufactured to be impossible to "zero" the burrs. I can understand now how so many people found this machine incapable of being subtle enough, in fineness and adjustability, for paring with upper-echelon machines. It seems to me, though, that if we just cut or grind down those shoulders and do the easy stepless mod -- that alone would probably be a pretty huge improvement, no? After that, the Mazzer swap would just be a final enhancement towards particle evenness and cutting down on fines, yes? Would I be off-base to imagine my path towards Proline greatness as: Step 1 = stepless, Step 2 = shoulder reduction, Step 3 = Mazzer swap?
gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,965 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Wed May 4, 2011, 1:21pm Subject: Re: KitchenAid Proline grinder w/mazzer mini burrs
That's a pretty good plan but the biggest defect, IMHO, is the un-trueness of the burr mount. The burrs will be almost touching at 12 o'clock and have a substantial gap at 6 o'clock until that issue is resolved. Bid chunks and tiny fines are the result. I did all the mods at one setting so I can't judge the results of the individual steps.
There is no known way to get around the limited grind adjustment even after making it stepless. The design, which uses coarse adjustment threads, is the limiting factor.
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