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Espresso too dense/strong
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Nickfrogger
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Nickfrogger
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 205
Location: Spokane
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia V3 w/PID,...
Grinder: Forte, Lelit PL53, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Yama TCA-5 Siphon
Drip: V60 (A red one!)
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 5:14pm
Subject: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Hello all,
    I'm asking a question I think I know the answer to, but I'm looking for more opinions and advice. My espresso's are extremely thick and rich in texture, which is good; however, the flavour is so strong they are difficult to drink.

    I am freshly grinding Alterra roast with a PL53 and using a delonghi ec155 with a naked and unpressurized portafilter mod. I believe my problem is my portafilter basket (which I set up for pre-ground, and it worked decently for that), as it holds probably 1.5 fl oz worth of... whatever. I'm estimating about 4-5 tablespoons unsettled grounds or about 26g of espresso grind.

    My shots take 28 seconds for 1.5oz espresso. The crema is extremely dark brown and very bubbly, I can hear the bubbles pop like rice puff cereal.

    I've tried just filling a part of the basket to get closer to the desired 16g of grounds. Obviously, that just resulted in a very fast and blonde pour as the puck dissolved.

    As much as I would like a Silvia or PL043, the money just isn't there right now. I have ordered a smaller filter basket, but that won't ship out until June 7th so I'm stuck like this for at least four weeks.

Anything I should try or do to make the shots more palatable until then, other than buy a new machine?
Thanks in advance!

~Nick

 
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Nickfrogger
Senior Member
Nickfrogger
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 205
Location: Spokane
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia V3 w/PID,...
Grinder: Forte, Lelit PL53, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Yama TCA-5 Siphon
Drip: V60 (A red one!)
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 5:15pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Err.. Sorry, just realized I posted this in discussion rather than Q&A. Sorry about that...

 
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JasonBrandtLewis
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JasonBrandtLewis
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Posts: 6,467
Location: Berkeley, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -...
Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: CCD, Chemex
Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 5:40pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Wait a minute.  You are pulling 1.5 oz with 26g?!?!?!?!

Why are you updosing so heavily?  "Standard" dosing is 7g for a single (1 oz); 14g for a double (2 oz).  Most people around here will indeed updose, but it's like 16-18g for a double ristretto -- 1.5 oz.  Good lord . . .

JasonBrandtLewis: eek4.gif

 
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Nickfrogger
Senior Member
Nickfrogger
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 205
Location: Spokane
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia V3 w/PID,...
Grinder: Forte, Lelit PL53, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Yama TCA-5 Siphon
Drip: V60 (A red one!)
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 6:03pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Hehe.. Yea. I'm using so much because I have such a huge basket, I tried using less and it just mixed in with the water because there wasn't a tight seal between the grouphead and espresso puck. The original basket for the machine is shot, and this basket worked quite well for preground because that stuff is flavourless.

    I ordered an appropriate 15-17g (unpressurized) basket, but the portafilter handle is on backorder until June 7th and I can't remove my current basket from the handle so I need both parts. I'm just looking for some suggestions until June 7th when I'll have everything I need.

Thanks a lot!

 
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SteveRhinehart
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SteveRhinehart
Joined: 27 Dec 2009
Posts: 855
Location: Syracuse, NY
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: 1970s La Pavoni Europiccola
Grinder: Baratza Vario, Hario Skerton
Vac Pot: Yama Tabletop 3-cup
Drip: Chemex, CCD, Kalita Wave,...
Roaster: Flavorwave/Stir Crazy
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 6:22pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Grind a little coarser, pull longer shots? Really, if you can't work with a regular double dose, may as well start pulling triples!
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frcn
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frcn
Joined: 23 Dec 2001
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Location: Northern California
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Vibiemme Domobar Double
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Roaster: computer controlled Hottop,...
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 6:24pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Use half as much coffee, and cut it with 4 ounces of hot water when the extraction is done.

 
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Nickfrogger
Senior Member
Nickfrogger
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 205
Location: Spokane
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rancilio Silvia V3 w/PID,...
Grinder: Forte, Lelit PL53, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Yama TCA-5 Siphon
Drip: V60 (A red one!)
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu May 19, 2011, 6:25pm
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

Well, I think I can kind of unofficially close this post; I managed to remove the giant filter basket with a hammer and screw driver. Ill use my Krups basket until I get my knew one. Just have to deal with the chuted bottom for a few weeks. Thanks for the responses everyone.

Cheers

 
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calblacksmith
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calblacksmith
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 7,947
Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
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Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
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Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Fri May 20, 2011, 5:59am
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

UH, it took a hammer and screwdriver to remove the basket from the PF handle?????????

I'll bet there was ALL KINDS of nasty gunk in there! When using my naked handle, there is nothing to clean in the handle but if I use one with spouts, after only a dozen doubles or so, there is a buildup of coffee oils that need to be wiped out of the bottom of the handle or they will start to taint the shots that follow. It gets a good cleaning every few weeks (the dry paper towels do a fairly good job of removing the oils between "cleanings")

 
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TheMadTamper
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Joined: 2 Nov 2010
Posts: 1,246
Location: US
Expertise: I live coffee

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Posted Fri May 20, 2011, 6:24am
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

We have a new winner!  That thoroughly trounces JonR's 23g doubles.....

I'm more intrigued by the notion that anyone managed to get a DeLonghi to pump water through 26 of coffee...I didn't think the pumps (and tubing) had it in them!
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JasonBrandtLewis
Senior Member
JasonBrandtLewis
Joined: 9 Dec 2005
Posts: 6,467
Location: Berkeley, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -...
Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -...
Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup
Drip: CCD, Chemex
Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Fri May 20, 2011, 6:37am
Subject: Re: Espresso too dense/strong
 

I just re-read this, and have some additional questions . . . .

Nickfrogger Said:

Hehe.. Yea. I'm using so much because I have such a huge basket, I tried using less and it just mixed in with the water because there wasn't a tight seal between the grouphead and espresso puck.

Posted May 19, 2011 link

There should NOT be "a seal" between the puck and the grouphead . . .

Nickfrogger Said:

The original basket for the machine is shot . . .

Posted May 19, 2011 link

How can a basket be "shot"?

 
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