In America at least Starbucks sold the masses on gourmet coffee and that required a lot of marketing a lot of money. Though the current quality of Starbucks coffee is not the definition of "gourmet" thay have started the ball rolling and have brought many to the gourmet market.
I think many gourmet coffee drinkers can recall days when they considered Starbucks .. gourmet but later moving on top bigger and better things like micro roasters .. home roasting .. prosumer espresso machines.
If Starbucks starts moving away from coffee can the true gourmet coffee shop afford to be the sole marketers of gourmet coffee ? Can they keep the ball rolling if Starbucks that giant commercial gourmet coffee machine leaves the coffee world ?
Will espresso become a side order at the local "Coffee Shop" ?
Kenntak Senior Member Joined: 10 Apr 2009 Posts: 50 Location: Florida Expertise: Just starting
Espresso: Gaggia Classic Grinder: Kyocera Hand Grinder
Posted Fri Jul 17, 2009, 7:23am Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
That's interesting, as part of its plan for some stores, Starbucks is considering shedding its well-known image in order to stay profitable. This brings to mind something I thought about a few days ago. I recently tried a local "gourment" coffeehouse. It was decorated nicely with wooden tables and free wifi. A nice place to hang out, drink coffee and surf the web. The one problem was that the espresso I purchased was awful. It was made in 5 seconds, had no crema at all, and had a diluted, poor coffee taste. I was rather shocked, because that place brags about hand selecting its beans, etc. and claims its coffee is better than Starbucks.
I started to think, with competition like this, Starbuck has nothing to worry about on the gourment end. I suppose one could compete with Starbucks in two ways, (1) by offereing better quality coffee, or (2) offering cheaper coffee and heavily promoting it. The coffeehouse I went to was trying the first approach, but by my observations was failing miserably by offering a subpar product. McDonald's is taking the latter approach and is apparently hurting Starbucks. At least in my area, Starbucks does not have to worry about competitors making a better product (especially considering the economic times), it has to worry about places like McDonald's.
FredK Senior Member Joined: 28 Jun 2009 Posts: 140 Location: NJ Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Gaggia Classic Grinder: Kyocera hand grinder Roaster: FreshRoast+8
Posted Fri Jul 17, 2009, 7:37am Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
Interesting article. I wonder if the real reason is because consumers are so anti-corporation these days. Starbucks is trying to distance themselves, from themselves.
Posted Fri Jul 17, 2009, 8:48am Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
FredK Said:
Interesting article. I wonder if the real reason is because consumers are so anti-corporation these days. Starbucks is trying to distance themselves, from themselves.
It will be readily apparent to any reasonably informed consumer whether an establishment is a corporate chain, a franchise chain, or an independent shop.
If a consumer can't tell by looking around, it probably doesn't matter to that consumer.
Sure, the gourmet shop can survive, even thrive - the problem is how. Actually serving good coffee is a huge start. Add strict standards of integrity, and I think they'll do fine.
CoffeeRoastersClub Senior Member Joined: 6 Jul 2005 Posts: 2,515 Location: Connecticut Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Vintage La Pavoni Lever... Grinder: KitchenAid Pro Line Burr... Vac Pot: Vintage Silex Drip: Aeropress, French Press Roaster: "Little Tyke" BBQ Drum,...
Posted Fri Jul 17, 2009, 7:22pm Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
Ehh, just getting a little more personal and putting a little Irish in their coffee. Broadening the market to tea drinkers and happy hour crowd provides a couple more revenue streams. If it works, great for Starbucks Corp. If not, Starbucks name doesn't lose much luster over the mistake.
Psyd Senior Member Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 1,178 Location: MON AZ Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Sylvia and Astoria Argenta... Grinder: Rocky and Astoria (Mazzer)...
Posted Sat Jul 18, 2009, 2:01pm Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
Personally I think their days in the sun have faded for good. They grew way too big too fast and over saturated their own market.Starbucks Investors; "Yay steak again!"
Market Analysts: "Ain't you guys a dairy farm?"
I call it the 'Dairyman's Dinner Syndrome'. Short-sighted; profit-driven; future, environment, and anyone-who-gets-in-our-way be damned, stock-price oriented corporate greed. You'll make a bundle for fifteen minutes, and then fade away.
FredK Senior Member Joined: 28 Jun 2009 Posts: 140 Location: NJ Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Gaggia Classic Grinder: Kyocera hand grinder Roaster: FreshRoast+8
Posted Sat Jul 18, 2009, 7:03pm Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
Psyd Said:
Starbucks Investors; "Yay steak again!"
Market Analysts: "Ain't you guys a dairy farm?"
I call it the 'Dairyman's Dinner Syndrome'. Short-sighted; profit-driven; future, environment, and anyone-who-gets-in-our-way be damned, stock-price oriented corporate greed. You'll make a bundle for fifteen minutes, and then fade away.
Seems like that is the current business model for most American corporations these days. Somewhere along the line we stopped caring about good products and services in favor of just appeasing stockholders. What a shame.
Posted Sun Jul 19, 2009, 9:04am Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
One of the things Starbucks does well is create a sense of place .. the thought of sitting in a Starbucks during a busy day on the road is enjoyable the thought ofsitting in a McDonalds is absolutely gross !!!
Zin1953 Senior Member Joined: 9 Dec 2005 Posts: 1,695 Location: Berkeley, CA Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -... Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -... Vac Pot: no, Press Pot Drip: Chemex Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Sun Jul 19, 2009, 4:33pm Subject: Re: Starbucks is a Changing .. Can the Gourmet Coffee Shop Survive ?
Let's face it: Starbucks is the same as any other large, multi-national corporation, and they managed to f*** things up -- the same as any other large, multi-national corporation.
Going into 15th Ave. Coffee & Tea (328 15th Ave. East, Seattle, WA 98112) will not be the same as going into Victrola Café (411 15th Ave. East, Seattle, WA 98112). It never will be. The bottom line: the coffee will always be different, as 15th Ave Coffee & Tea will still be making Starbucks, and a venti caramel latté by any other name . . .
Changing the name from "Starbucks" to whatever street you're on doesn't change the fact you're still at a Starbucks. The coffee will be the same. The superautos will be gone, true, and they will go back to (probably) La Marzocco Lineas, or something similar, but that won't make the coffee GREAT -- it will return Starbucks back to where they were prior to throwing out all the La Marzocco Lineas in the first place! They still won't be a "third wave" coffee house/roaster.
Serving beer and wine? Obviously they aren't a bar, nor are they turning 15th Ave. Coffee & Tea into a bar. Beer and wine will be available, but if I'm buzzed, will the coffee taste any better? Doubtful. It's still Starbucks, after all.
Everyone in the neighborhood will check it out . . . once. If they were Starbucks customers before, they will be Starbucks customers again -- either be continuing to go to a Starbucks location because it's faster and more convenient, or by going to 15th Ave. Coffee & Tea because, you know, this tastes just like the old Starbucks that used to be here. Those that prefer going to a "third wave" café/roaster will still go to Victrola Coffee, or to Caffè Ladro (435 15th Ave. East, Seattle, WA, 98112), or to . . . or . . . or . . . .
Starbucks has acknowledged many of the mistakes they've made (remember Howard Schultz saying it was a mistake to pre-bag all the coffee? that Starbucks lost something when customers could walk into a café and not smell the coffee!), and some they haven't. Going "stealth" under a variety of different names will, I have no doubt, fool some people, but probably not the majority of customers. Instead of being an "independent," it will be a -- what? high-end? more casual? more "college-like"? -- coffee house, but it will still be serving Starbucks coffee. The only difference will be cost: it will cost the corporation far more to have a small run of coffee cups printed with a "15th Ave. Coffee & Tea" logo (not to mention the initial start-up costs of designing one) than mearly to ship over another 10,000 cups with the Starbucks logo . . .
Maybe they're hoping to make $$$$ off the beer and wine sales, I don't know, but this seems to me like another way Starbucks is increasing their costs without a) increasing the quality of their product, and b) increasing their return to their shareholders. It's a lose-lose situation . . . .
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