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Buckley
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Joined: 25 Jan 2011
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Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 8:55am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

Yeah.  Agree with emradguy.  Sealing small batches like small ziplocks within your foil bag may be your answer, or best to only put small batches in each foil bag so you do not have to put it back in the freezer.  In addition to what emradguy said, there is a debate on whether freezing shortens the freshness life of beans once they have been thawed.  I say yes.  Some agree, some disagree.  On top of that. freezing thawed beans a second time may possibly degrade them.  On the other hand, in a bad refrigerastor freezer (one that loses all its air when opened and/or has a stong defrost function) perhaps the beans are freezing/partially thawing on a daily basis.  Who knows what uncontrolled environments people are using to freeze their beans and still enjoying the result, perhaps legitimately so?  Most would agree to freeze in batches that, once thawed, can be used up in a few days.  For some people that is two days and for others it is a week.
If you feel that you are successfully preserving the freshness of your roasted beans, then you are doing what is right for you.

Buckley
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Burner0000
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Posted Thu Feb 13, 2014, 9:32am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

Buckley Said:

Yeah.  Agree with emradguy.  Sealing small batches like small ziplocks within your foil bag may be your answer, or best to only put small batches in each foil bag so you do not have to put it back in the freezer.  In addition to what emradguy said, there is a debate on whether freezing shortens the freshness life of beans once they have been thawed.  I say yes.  Some agree, some disagree.  On top of that. freezing thawed beans a second time may possibly degrade them.  On the other hand, in a bad refrigerastor freezer (one that loses all its air when opened and/or has a stong defrost function) perhaps the beans are freezing/partially thawing on a daily basis.  Who knows what uncontrolled environments people are using to freeze their beans and still enjoying the result, perhaps legitimately so?  Most would agree to freeze in batches that, once thawed, can be used up in a few days.  For some people that is two days and for others it is a week.
If you feel that you are successfully preserving the freshness of your roasted beans, then you are doing what is right for you.

Buckley

Posted February 13, 2014 link

Gotcha!  Thanks everyone for the info.   I have split into 1/4 - 1/4 ziplock freezer bags inside the valved foil bags.  I am able to just unzip the bags without even having to take them out of the freezer too. Once I finish what I'm currently drinking I'll try thawing some.
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CoffeeLoversMag
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Posted Fri Feb 14, 2014, 5:28am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

I wonder why you have plenty of coffee beans when you just need them for your own consumption. I could imagine how plenty your stock of coffee beans when 1 ton of which is equivalent to 1,000 kilogram. There’s nothing wrong if you are preserving them in a freezer provided that they are fully sealed. However we cannot guarantee that they are wholly secured, there might be trouble in the freezer or leaking in your packing. If I were you, dispose them to your friend or selling them at the same price.

 
Did you know...? Dark roast coffees actually have less caffeine than lighter roasts due to the fact that the process of roasting burns off caffeine.
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Burner0000
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Posted Fri Feb 14, 2014, 6:31am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

CoffeeLoversMag Said:

I wonder why you have plenty of coffee beans when you just need them for your own consumption. I could imagine how plenty your stock of coffee beans when 1 ton of which is equivalent to 1,000 kilogram. There’s nothing wrong if you are preserving them in a freezer provided that they are fully sealed. However we cannot guarantee that they are wholly secured, there might be trouble in the freezer or leaking in your packing. If I were you, dispose them to your friend or selling them at the same price.

Posted February 14, 2014 link

 All of my friends and family have their fill of coffee. I usually give it away or sell it cheap but this time I thought I'd give freezing a try.  I use my Sonofresco 1.4 lb model for all roasting and sampling now. My FR SR500 wasn't giving me good results.I still might give a lot of it away but I am really curious to see how freezing my beans goes.
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Burner0000
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Posted Thu Feb 20, 2014, 7:18am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

I just grabbed some beans out of the freezer to thaw overnight. Looks like a nice dry thaw. :) Beans look and smell amazing! I'll be blending and grinding up some today to brew tomorrow.  I'll post the results then. :)
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calblacksmith
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Posted Thu Feb 20, 2014, 7:33am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

OOPS, I lost track of this thread and did not answer you!

I use bags like I said, they tend to be flat so they make a lot of contact with the counter. As they are flat and thin, the cross section is not great and it tends to thaw quickly. As a rough guess, for me, the way I freeze, about an hour is all that is needed. In a VERY rare situation where I forget to leave out overnight, I have, gasp, used a microwave to warm them. 30 seconds on high, kneed the bag to move them around and even out the internal temp, another 30 seconds, lather rinse and repeat until nearly room temp.

When discussions on how much beans warm during grinding warms the beans, I suppose I have just lost 99% of the readership with the microwave comment but HEY, I NEEDED COFFEE and I did not have an hour to wait.

I do make small batches, about 3/4 pound or a few days worth of use so the thawed beans do not have a long time on the counter to endure so I have never noticed a shorter life after thawing, they just do not have that much time out on the counter.

So, how did it go this morning?

 
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Burner0000
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Posted Thu Feb 20, 2014, 7:41am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

calblacksmith Said:

OOPS, I lost track of this thread and did not answer you!

I use bags like I said, they tend to be flat so they make a lot of contact with the counter. As they are flat and thin, the cross section is not great and it tends to thaw quickly. As a rough guess, for me, the way I freeze, about an hour is all that is needed. In a VERY rare situation where I forget to leave out overnight, I have, gasp, used a microwave to warm them. 30 seconds on high, kneed the bag to move them around and even out the internal temp, another 30 seconds, lather rinse and repeat until nearly room temp.

When discussions on how much beans warm during grinding warms the beans, I suppose I have just lost 99% of the readership with the microwave comment but HEY, I NEEDED COFFEE and I did not have an hour to wait.

I do make small batches, about 3/4 pound or a few days worth of use so the thawed beans do not have a long time on the counter to endure so I have never noticed a shorter life after thawing, they just do not have that much time out on the counter.

So, how did it go this morning?

Posted February 20, 2014 link

Meh.. It's your stock and if it tastes good who cares if you used "chef mike" to thaw.  :p  
I used some of the Brazil Fazenda I froze to go with what I had left for my morning double Americano.  Still was pretty good. No taste of freezer burn or staleness. Tomorrow is the real test.
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dana_leighton
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dana_leighton
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Posted Thu Feb 20, 2014, 8:04am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

emradguy Said:

Let it come to room temp before opening it, otherwise, moisture in the air will condense on the beans and make you an unhappy camper.

Posted February 10, 2014 link

There is anecdotal evidence from some very competent folks that counters this conventional "wisdom." it appears our theories about the effect of condensation may be incorrect, or at least that the effect is not as detectable in the cup as we thought it might be.

See this thread and this thread over at H-B.

 
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
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Buckley
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Posted Fri Feb 21, 2014, 6:20am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

Dear Dana,
Thank you for introducing the threads from H-B.  It goes a long way toward answering the question that I asked several posts prior in this thread.  There doesn’t seem to be any tangible condensation that ‘mucks up’ our enjoyment of ground-while-frozen beans.  To be clear, we were wondering about condensation on two fronts: one was on the beans as they get loaded into the grinder and the other was the repeated exposure of the beans that remain in the freezer as their container gets repeatedly opened and the air in the container becomes successively replaced with ambient air.  The anecdotes – and lack of any cautionary posts – all seem to reassure us the condensation is nothing that we need to worry about.  Or is it?
Notice that I said “tangible condensation” above.  What is the possible effect of intangible condensation on the coffee beans?  One beneficial effect would be the decrease in static electricity scattering the grounds as they come out of the grinder chute.  Therefore, if someone is having problems with static electricity as they grind, it would interesting to hear a report about whether or not this occurrence is diminished if they grind freezer-cold beans.   Conversely, one concern that may be in the back of some’s mind is whether or not some intangible moisture is being transferred to the grinder burrs from cold beans.  Since burrs are most often tool steel, they are prone to corrosion in the presence of moisture.  This would most likely only show up over time.

Concerning the lack of reports about condensation, we do not rigorously track the location of the anecdotal posts, but it may be that they all come from western temperate areas with mild humidity or even extremely dry air, as it occurs for half of the year (okay, one-third of the year) during winter in the northern US and Canada.  One report mentions humidity in the 70s. But what about preserving coffee in areas of persistent high humidity like Singapore or Hong Kong?  Several posts concerning preserving coffee freshness have come from members in these areas, but I do not recall if the subject of observable, tangible condensation arose.  I would still like to hear a reliable post from the tropics that relates to the experience of grinding frozen beans.
Finally, to avoid pedantry, I will avoid discussing the physics of grinding cold beans.  There is an extensive literature on freeze-fracturing of organic materials.  A professor in my school, Bertie Scharer, I believe, became quite distinguished for her discovery of applying freeze fracturing to cells for subsequent electon microscopy examination.  Obviously, this is overkill as regards grinding coffee.

B
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dana_leighton
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dana_leighton
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Posted Fri Feb 21, 2014, 8:29am
Subject: Re: Another coffee freezing question
 

Buckley Said:

Since burrs are most often tool steel, they are prone to corrosion in the presence of moisture.

Posted February 21, 2014 link

Do you suppose the burrs would be protected from moisture by the coffee oils that build up on them?

Buckley Said:

A professor in my school, Bertie Scharer, I believe, became quite distinguished for her discovery of applying freeze fracturing to cells for subsequent electon microscopy examination.  Obviously, this is overkill as regards grinding coffee.

Posted February 21, 2014 link

Not for the some of us coffee geeks! :-)

 
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
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