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CMIN
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 8:37am
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

Yeh I've never understood why so many think Moka makes burnt 212 degree coffee, if you know how to use Moka then you would know that's not true. I've never had "burnt" coffee taste from Moka except when I started using and didn't know the real way to use it correctly. So many just leave it on the stove on, well yeh then it'll be burnt tasting lol. But then I learned the real ways and tricks from my Cuban friends lol.
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jpender
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 10:52am
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

CMIN Said:

Yeh I've never understood why so many think Moka makes burnt 212 degree coffee, if you know how to use Moka then you would know that's not true.

Posted November 22, 2013 link

I think it's a natural mistake to think that the water needs to be boiling to create steam pressure. You can't see what's going on inside.

It's easy to let the water get too hot and ruin the coffee. My moka pot will hit 110C at the end if I just let it go. Luciano Navarini published a paper on the moka pot (he used a 3 cup Moka Express in his experiments) and in his runs the water went well above 100C at the very end. Here is a plot from that paper.

jpender: navarini_fig4.jpg
(Click for larger image)
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canuckcoffeeguy
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canuckcoffeeguy
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 11:05am
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

Jpender, great to see all of the research that has been done on Moka pots. I'm curious if the Brikka, which I use, varies in its result -- since its cap/spout delays the release of the brew into the upper chamber, until a sudden burst at the end. From what can tell, this differs from the more gradual sputtering of other Moka pots.

Does the Brikka's brew method affect the result in the cup?
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jpender
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jpender
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 12:31pm
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

canuckcoffeeguy Said:

great to see all of the research that has been done on Moka pots

Posted November 22, 2013 link

All that research? In Navarini it is stated that as far as the authors' know theirs was the first (published) experimental investigation of the moka pot and one of only two papers to correctly characterize the physics. Even in the scientific literature it has been poorly described.

From Navarini:
"Despite its well-established usage, the moka has never been
the subject of detailed analysis, which led to a series of unclear descriptions or
misinterpretations concerning its functioning, such as the consolidated misbelieve
that standard atmosphere boiling point temperature is needed to drive the water
out. The detailed measurement of the thermodynamics of the moka, described here,
sheds light on its actual behaviour. It is shown that extraction commences at pretty
low temperatures and depends on the initial ammount of dry air in the kettle.
"


canuckcoffeeguy Said:

I'm curious if the Brikka, which I use, varies in its result -- since its cap/spout delays the release of the brew into the upper chamber, until a sudden burst at the end. From what can tell, this differs from the more gradual sputtering of other Moka pots.

Does the Brikka's brew method affect the result in the cup?

Posted November 22, 2013 link

I'm sure it does, but how exactly I can only guess. It's likely that Bialetti knows quite a bit about the Brikka but as for published details I know of none.

I've been meaning for some time to buy a Brikka, partly because I'd like to try one and partly because I'm curious to stick probes into it. But they are a little bit expensive and I've been busy so it keeps getting pushed forward.

I also can't decide whether to buy the 2 cup or 4 cup model. Which would you recommend?
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canuckcoffeeguy
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canuckcoffeeguy
Joined: 22 Aug 2013
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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 1:17pm
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

I have the 2 cup model, so I can only vouch for that one. I haven't used the 4 cup version and have no idea if there's a difference. Anyone know if there's a difference?

Of interest, I also found this alternative Moka pot tutorial from James Hoffman:
click here
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CoffeeRoastersClub
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 5:34pm
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

canuckcoffeeguy Said:

I have the 2 cup model, so I can only vouch for that one. I haven't used the 4 cup version and have no idea if there's a difference. Anyone know if there's a difference?

Of interest, I also found this alternative Moka pot tutorial from James Hoffman:
click here

Posted November 22, 2013 link

Just the opposite here.  I have the 4 cup model and have only used it.  From what I read the 2 cup may produce a better fake crema.  FWIW.

Len

 
"Coffee leads men to trifle away their time, scald their chops, and spend their money, all for a little base, black, thick, nasty, bitter, stinking nauseous puddle water." ~The Women's Petition Against Coffee, 1674

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Zyk
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Joined: 20 Nov 2013
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 5:51pm
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

Update: After heehawing for a week and reading the posts here, I finally made a decision on a moka pot. I'm going to give the 4 cup Brikka a shot. It's due to arrive before the end of the month.
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CoffeeRoastersClub
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Posted Fri Nov 22, 2013, 7:09pm
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

Zyk Said:

Update: After heehawing for a week and reading the posts here, I finally made a decision on a moka pot. I'm going to give the 4 cup Brikka a shot. It's due to arrive before the end of the month.

Posted November 22, 2013 link

Hello Zyk.  You may find the following video my wife and I made about using the 4 cup Brikka.  We made it a while back and posted it on youtube:

Click Here (www.youtube.com)

Len

 
"Coffee leads men to trifle away their time, scald their chops, and spend their money, all for a little base, black, thick, nasty, bitter, stinking nauseous puddle water." ~The Women's Petition Against Coffee, 1674

Bitcoin Merchant www.CoffeeRoastersClub.com     www.javaPRO-CRC.com
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NobbyR
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NobbyR
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Posted Mon Nov 25, 2013, 7:38am
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

CMIN Said:

So many just leave it on the stove on, well yeh then it'll be burnt tasting lol.

Posted November 22, 2013 link

Agreed. As you can read in my post, I advise to observe your moka pot, and to take it off the stove early.

 
***
"This drink of the Satan is so delicious that it would be a shame to leave it to the infidels." (Pope Clement VIII on coffee, when he was urged to ban the beverage)
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Zyk
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Joined: 20 Nov 2013
Posts: 5
Location: Iowa
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Mon Nov 25, 2013, 7:54am
Subject: Re: Need Some Advice On Moka Pots
 

The YouTube video helped a lot. Thanks! I'll be getting my Brikka, if all goes well, on Friday. A few break in runs and we'll see how everything goes once I get some practice. :)
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