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Coffee just never comes out right
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Thecoffeenerd
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Joined: 14 Jun 2013
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Expertise: I live coffee

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Posted Sun Sep 8, 2013, 8:36am
Subject: Coffee just never comes out right
 

No matter how I brew my coffee It never comes out the way I want It too. I've struggled with this problem for so long and I've made so many posts on here trying to get the problem fixed. I grind the beans fresh to a Folgers like grind and I use 70 grams of coffee to 1190 grams of water which Is a 1:17 brew ratio and the temperature of the water Is 200 degree's. I'm using a Bunn coffee maker the brews the coffee to SCAA requirements but no matter how much I do everything correctly the coffee never has any body and Is oh so weak and I just wanna give up. I'm supposed to be using 2 tablespoons per 6 oz of water...Is 1:17 that ratio?

 
"You can't make good coffee, without good coffee" -Thecoffeenerd
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JKalpin
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JKalpin
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
Posts: 803
Location: Thornhill, Ontario Canada
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Aerobie Aeropress
Grinder: Baratza Maestro Plus
Vac Pot: Yama 5-Cup
Drip: Krups Moka Brew, BraZen
Roaster: Freshroast+8, Behmor 1600
Posted Sun Sep 8, 2013, 8:53am
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

2 tablespoons of coffee per 6 oz of water is not exactly 70g.  I suggest you use a scale.  Jennings makes all kinds of small scales that will accurately measure 70 grams for you.

Is the strength of the brew OK using (actual) Folgers?  That's your standard for 'grind sizing'.

When I get coffee that is not 'intense' and everything else is right, I start grinding progressively finer until I get adequate body.

 
Jerry
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Anthorn
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Joined: 5 Sep 2011
Posts: 21
Location: Luton, Bedfordshire, United Kingdom
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Sun Sep 8, 2013, 10:29am
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

The tell-tale evidence to look for is bitterness: If the coffee is weak and bitter that means the coffee has been exhausted and over-brewed. So in that case use more coffee. If it's weak and not bitter then try a finer grind. What is said to be "best" may not be best for you so it will be a process of trial and error of different coffee and brewing methods to find your own personal best. All anyone can do is advise in general terms.
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Thecoffeenerd
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Joined: 14 Jun 2013
Posts: 215
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Expertise: I live coffee

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Posted Sun Sep 8, 2013, 3:31pm
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

JKalpin Said:

2 tablespoons of coffee per 6 oz of water is not exactly 70g.  I suggest you use a scale.  Jennings makes all kinds of small scales that will accurately measure 70 grams for you.

Is the strength of the brew OK using (actual) Folgers?  That's your standard for 'grind sizing'.

When I get coffee that is not 'intense' and everything else is right, I start grinding progressively finer until I get adequate body.

Posted September 8, 2013 link


I own a scale. I haven't brewed a cup of actual Folgers though...If 2 tablespoons of coffee per 6 oz of water is not exactly 70g then what amount of coffee is? and what amount of water?

 
"You can't make good coffee, without good coffee" -Thecoffeenerd
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JKalpin
Senior Member
JKalpin
Joined: 28 Dec 2008
Posts: 803
Location: Thornhill, Ontario Canada
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Aerobie Aeropress
Grinder: Baratza Maestro Plus
Vac Pot: Yama 5-Cup
Drip: Krups Moka Brew, BraZen
Roaster: Freshroast+8, Behmor 1600
Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 6:33am
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

Let me be more specific:

My Krups Moka Brew was very sensitive to coffee/water ratio and I actually weighed out each charge of coffee and each litre of water ?!

With my Brazen, I fill the reservoir to the 1.2 litre 'line' and weigh 65 grams of beans into the grinder.

OTOH, with my Aeropress, I soon found out that one of their heaping scoops of beans is pretty reliably 16 grams so I just scoop it into the grinder without weighing.

If I found a problem with a brewer, I would always weigh the beans, or the ground coffee (to solve it) not relaying on 1 spoon = so-many grams.

 
Jerry
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Netphilosopher
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Joined: 14 Jan 2011
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Location: USA
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 10:48am
Subject: ...
 

...
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emradguy
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emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,154
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
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Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 11:48am
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

Thecoffeenerd Said:

I own a scale. If 2 tablespoons of coffee per 6 oz of water is not exactly 70g then what amount of coffee is?

Posted September 8, 2013 link

70g = 70g, you can't just translate a volume to weight for coffee beans.  The reason has a lot to do with the shape of the beans, which allows for varying amounts of air to get between them.  However, there's more to it...depending on bean age and roast degree, even beans that are exactly the same size will weigh differently.  So, you can't simply measure out a volume of beans and expect them to always weigh the same as the last measurement.  since you have a scale, use it...every time.  That's the only way yo're going to get an accurate measure of how much coffee you're using. It was either Len or Steve that started a thread a while back asking people to weigh a scoop of beans using the supplied Aeropress scoop.  The results (from those who chimed in) were all over the place.  To use an analogy, it's like trying to hit a bullseye (and ONLY the bullseye) with a shotgun on a target from 30 feet, when you've got a sniper rifle sitting there next to you.

Thecoffeenerd Said:

and what amount of water?

Posted September 8, 2013 link

this one's easy!  density of water is 1g/ml. 1 oz is 28.35g. Therefore, 6oz = 6 x 28.35 = 170.1g = 170ml

 
.
Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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Thecoffeenerd
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Joined: 14 Jun 2013
Posts: 215
Location: N/A
Expertise: I live coffee

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Grinder: Baratza Encore, Bodum Bistro...
Vac Pot: N/A
Drip: Bunn Phase Brew 8 Cup, Hario...
Roaster: N/A
Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 1:30pm
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

I will definitely try Netphilosophers test's soon. I was first going to try brewing on setting 16 with more coffee (1:16) going from 70 to 74 grams of coffee to the same amount of water (1190) I heard this may help. And It may help make my brew time longer as well, which I have also struggled with. My brewer brews to quickly and I know that's a biggie for coffee. The brew time. And also If the brewer still brews less then five minutes then I heard to grind finer. Some people on here say that doesn't help, but I've heard from professional coffee company's that grinding finer will help slow the flow of water and increase the time the coffee brews. I have a lot of coffee test's to run through and I hopefully can get this resolved! I definitely believe using more coffee will help...and so will increasing my brew time. I plan on buying a more accurate scale and I'm looking at a the Jennings CJ4000 Scale or the Escali arti scale. Opinions?

 
"You can't make good coffee, without good coffee" -Thecoffeenerd
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Netphilosopher
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Joined: 14 Jan 2011
Posts: 1,602
Location: USA
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 1:53pm
Subject: ...
 

...
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al_bongo
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Joined: 26 Aug 2008
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Location: Scotland
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Posted Mon Sep 9, 2013, 1:57pm
Subject: Re: Coffee just never comes out right
 

Thecoffeenerd Said:

I will definitely try Netphilosophers test's soon. I was first going to try brewing on setting 16 with more coffee (1:16) going from 70 to 74 grams of coffee to the same amount of water (1190) I heard this may help.

Posted September 9, 2013 link

Why would you do this? 4g isn't even 6 per cent more coffee? Netphilosopher has given you two extremes to try. This seems good advice to me since it will give you two extremes within which there is a grind size which is perfect. Your machine will be capable of making cup of coffee that is unpleasantly strong so there is a sweet spot between too weak and too strong.

A finer grind may extend the brew time but the real reason to use a finer grind is that the coffee will extract quicker and therefore requires a shorter brewing time which your machine provides. Again Netphilosopher has given you an efficient way to pinpoint the grind suitable for your machine.

You can't majorly change the time of your brew cycle so the only thing to do is grind finer to suit the brew cycle of your machine. It's immaterial what the grind size of Folgers is or that you might end up using a finer grind than the recommended drip setting for the Baratza. It's the grind that works for your machine that's important.

The Jennings C4000 scale, I think is excellent and it's what I use.
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