niciom Senior Member Joined: 17 Nov 2012 Posts: 1 Location: UK Expertise: Just starting
Posted Sat Nov 17, 2012, 8:11am Subject: Which Coffee Machine to buy
Hi, I am wanting to buy a coffee machine as a house gift, but am very confused which one to buy. I want one that can make regular coffee and Cappuccino's, that you can either put coffee beans into or ground Coffee. Price can vary from £100-£300
Posted Thu Nov 22, 2012, 3:26pm Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
Hello, Niciom.
I'm sorry you haven't received the type of ideas you are asking for, and that your question has been ridiculed.
The problem is partly that this is a forum mainly populated by people for whom coffee is a bit of an obsession and wouldn't have much knowledge of the types of machine you are asking about, and partly that those sorts of hybrid machine - although they do exist to some extent - aren't very common.
When you say cappuccino and regular coffee, it implies you want a machine that will make espresso shots (which are the basis of cappuccino) can froth milk and also make brewed filter type coffee. There are some out there, but you won't find anyone on here who would recommend one I'm afraid, and I doubt there are any that include a grinder so you can start with whole beans.
A slightly different approach may be to think about a machine which makes espresso, froths milk and includes a built in grinder so you can start with whole beans (there is normally an option to input pre-ground coffee as well). You don't get conventionally brewed coffee, but you can make Americano, which is espresso topped up with hot water to make a longer drink.
There are lots of those about. That one is one of the cheapest I've seen, and for the price is probably one of the best bargains, but I have no personal knowledge of how good or otherwise it is.
They are heartily disliked by the coffeegeeks, as they don't do a very good job when set against the strict criteria by which this forum would judge the coffee they make - but that is an extremely demanding standard. The domestic ones (there are commercial ones costing many thousands) have a poor reputation for reliability, although I can't testify to that personally as I have never owned one. They have to perform quite mechanically complicated and precise processes to produce the coffee, but at the same time have to be cheaply mass produced. Those 2 requirements don't fit together well.
If that is really what you want to go for I think it comes down to personal preference on your part and perhaps cosmetic appeal. A lot of them while having different brand badges on the outside, have the same mechanical innards.
Posted Thu Nov 22, 2012, 7:34pm Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
If you're buying a house gift, I'd actually shy away from any type of coffee maker. A gift certificate at a place that can offer advice and provide a wide assortment of machines that the person you are wanting to give a gift may be a better choice, as that way, they're not put in the position of receiving a gift they may not have a use for.
As you might be able to guess from the comments posted here, coffee can be a very personal decision and some people are not willing to settle for anything below a certain standard they've set for themselves. It can certainly be overwhelming, and if you haven't yet developed a palate for coffee, it can seem a bit extreme.
I wouldn't follow the advice given by tha anonymous member above, for a variety of reasons. First, I would never be inclined to trust the advice of someone who's not willing to put their name on it. Second, the types of machines he's pointing to don't do anything particularly well, they just do a wider number of things with, at best, mediocre results. We all have to settle for enough mediocrity in life as it is, there's no need to force it on others. Give them the option to chose it for themselves, don't choose it for them.
Posted Fri Nov 23, 2012, 3:32am Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
GVDub Said:
I wouldn't follow the advice given by tha anonymous member above, for a variety of reasons. First, I would never be inclined to trust the advice of someone who's not willing to put their name on it. Second, the types of machines he's pointing to don't do anything particularly well, they just do a wider number of things with, at best, mediocre results. We all have to settle for enough mediocrity in life as it is, there's no need to force it on others. Give them the option to chose it for themselves, don't choose it for them.
The post on which you comment contains information and - if you want to call it that - "advice"
The information is that such machines do exist at around the OP's price range (actually just above probably) and the link simply exemplifies the type of machine referred to. As it happens (it was just the first one I found for illustrative purposes) at the price being asked by Amazon it is quite cheap for that sort of device in the OP's market area.
The "advice" consists mainly of the following:-
"They are heartily disliked by the coffeegeeks, as they don't do a very good job when set against the strict criteria by which this forum would judge the coffee they make - but that is an extremely demanding standard."
"The domestic ones (there are commercial ones costing many thousands) have a poor reputation for reliability, although I can't testify to that personally as I have never owned one."
"They have to perform quite mechanically complicated and precise processes to produce the coffee, but at the same time have to be cheaply mass produced. Those 2 requirements don't fit together well."
It would be good to think that most fair minded people would view the post as a balanced response to a new member asking for advice who hadn't received anything much constructive up to that point. Clearly you do not.
Posted Fri Nov 23, 2012, 3:55am Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
GVDub Said:
I wouldn't follow the advice given by tha anonymous member above, for a variety of reasons. First, I would never be inclined to trust the advice of someone who's not willing to put their name on it.
I would venture that ______________ aka Keepitsimple aka Rob E. is quite knowledgeable about things coffee related in general and particularly well versed in what is available in the European market place. I missed what happened to cause him to change his screen name (seems like a protest stance against something that happened) but to discredit his advice is an error.
I chew coffee beans with my teeth while gargling with 195 F water to enjoy coffee. What is this "coffee brewing" device you speak of?
Cerridwyn Senior Member Joined: 6 Jun 2010 Posts: 395 Location: Inland Empire California Expertise: I live coffee
Posted Fri Nov 23, 2012, 8:28am Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
I actually own an automatic, shock of shocks. Not for home but for work. It was the best compromise I could come up with. I own a Jura Impressa F9, an old one, from before Capressa became a part of the organization. It works well. Does it make the world's most awesome coffee? No, does it even really make Americanos, no. And I actually like what it does better than an Americano.
But it's good enough for flavored capps that a lot of people like and for the majority of people at work who add milk and/or sugar to their coffee. They say it is the best coffee they drink (because I use decent beans in it.) In fact it makes much better coffee than a traditional coffee maker that comes with a grinder built in for whole beans. (I can't compare it to a Brazen, as I don't have one yet.) And everyone can get their coffee how they like it. So for work it is a win win. I bought it on eBay for about half what a refurbed one would cost. I wouldn't pay full price for one though, that's way too much money.
Would I have one at home, oh heck no. But work does not allow me time to make coffee the way I like it and the closest place to go get it would take me about 30 minutes round trip, not something I can do. I envy people with a 3rd tier coffee house close to home/work.
But they idea of a gift card to some place, if there is a place like that close to you is a good one. Or if they are coffee lovers, what about one to someplace to buy the actual coffee?
Posted Fri Nov 23, 2012, 8:46am Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
I've owned a super-auto and it was extraordinarily mediorcre. You might even say it achived the height of medioctriy. It made coffee that was, by and large, drinkable, but in no ways better. Offer it crappy beans, I suppose the best that could be said for it was that it cared less about bean quality than any other coffee or expresso machine I've ever had.
Encouraging the spread of mediocrity does us all a disservice. Advising others to seek mediocrity, especially to give mediocrity to others so that they can sink into the noise floor along with everybody else curtails the chance to experience excellence. Not just talking coffee here — music, art, food, literature, manufactured items, thought — they're all subject to the same forces dragging them down into the land of 'meh'.
So, when someone comes to a site dedicated to excellence in coffee and receives advice that they should go home and make mediocre coffee and spread the message of mediocrity to the friends about whom they care enough to bring a fairly expensive gift, I think it's safe to speak up against that advice. I also stand by my advice to give a gift card to an establishment that can offer hands-on advice to the intended user and help them find the machine that's going to make the best coffee to their taste.
Posted Fri Nov 23, 2012, 9:16am Subject: Re: Which Coffee Machine to buy
GVDub Said:
So, when someone comes to a site dedicated to excellence in coffee and receives advice that they should go home and make mediocre coffee and spread the message of mediocrity to the friends about whom they care enough to bring a fairly expensive gift, I think it's safe to speak up against that advice.
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