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Is it possilbe that I don't like good coffee?
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Discussions > Coffee > Q and A > Is it possilbe...  
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DeanOK
Senior Member
DeanOK
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 647
Location: OK
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: QM Vetrano 2B
Grinder: Vario W
Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 6:05am
Subject: Re: Is it possible that I don't like good coffee?
 

This is a little long... sorry.

OK... years ago when I first started making espresso drinks it was a quick and easy start for me. I bought a 300 page book called "Espresso Quick Reference Guide".  Not sure how much of a quick reference 300 pages can be, but I read it and I bought an espresso machine and a grinder near the same time. Funny thing is that I don't remember what experience caused me to get interested in espresso in the beginning because I was never a coffee drinker before that.

I would pull a 2oz shot with my portafilter pretty full of finely ground coffee. I don't remember ever choking the machine, but there is a good chance the grind was too fine. The reason I know it was a 2oz shot is because I always used a little small stainless steel pitcher (that I still have) for the espresso because, since I always added milk to my drinks, I would have to pour the espresso in a larger cup. I am not sure how much coffee I used but the portafilter I had packed with my finely ground coffee. It was  a double head, but my little pitcher would catch the espresso that dripped out of both sides of the portafilter. There was no pressure gauge on the machine I had and it had a 15 bar pump. I am not sure I ever timed the time of the shot. I added somewhere around 4 to 6 oz oz of steamed milk. Probably always 2% or less because I think I remember reading in the above referenced book that milk over 2% didn't steam well. In those days I drank a lot of mochas and I always added flavoring...my favorite being praline.

I drank at least two of these a day. One in the morning and one in the evening... hence the reason I quit drinking them years ago when I was gaining weight. Put the machine away and thought about it often, but never decided to start drinking espresso again until last year. Took the old machine out of the cabinet. but it had a leak on the pump discharge and needed a new portafilter gasket, so I decided to just buy a new super auto. Now I have a ENA 4 and I do not like the espresso drinks I am making. I did not drink coffee from the time I drank my espresso drinks in the 90's until now with the occasional stop by a local coffee shop to get a mocha. I don't like every espresso drink I get from local coffee shops, but I like most all of them better than what I have been able to make at home with fresh coffee and the ENA. I have read a lot of complaints about the super autos, and I know I have a cheaper one, but I can't imagine that I can't get coffee that is decent.

Last week, when I was making espresso with a bag of Elemental 228 that I bought locally, I actually had a few drinks (after I got the machine dialed in), that I thought were pretty good. I ran out of that batch of beans and my Redbird arrived, and I wasn't so crazy about the Redbird, so I went back and bought some more Elemental 228. Different batch, and I have not made a single espresso from this batch of beans that I thought was as good was what  I made last week, even though the machine is set exactly the same.

With this machine, the best I can seem to come up with is two one ounce shots with the machine set to normal flavor, which I think is about 9 grams of coffee. This 1 oz shot is no more than 10 seconds not counting the pre-infusion. I have the grind set as fine as it will go, but it is no where nearly has fine as I used to grind my coffee when I used my old cheapo manual machine.
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TheSunInsideYou
Senior Member
TheSunInsideYou
Joined: 16 Feb 2012
Posts: 206
Location: NJ and NYC
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Breville BES900XL
Grinder: Laranzato HC-600, OE LIDO,...
Vac Pot: Yama 3
Drip: Hario V60, Chemex
Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 6:34am
Subject: Re: Is it possible that I don't like good coffee?
 

A thought on the coffee beans you're using:

You mentioned that you think the darker the roast is, the less you like it, which seems to follow your thought that you need sugar in your drinks. The truth is, it's very possible that no coffee will ever be sweet enough for you to enjoy black. BUT. There are a lot of very sweet coffees out there that you may have never tried. Typically, sweet coffees from quality roasters are roasted lightly to allow the sweetness to shine. Ritual is the most obvious choice in my mind (and GoCoffeeGo.com is having a "buy 2, get free shipping" deal this week), but Verve's new shipments of Ethiopians and Kenyans look promising as well. There are others, of course.

-Dave-
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CMIN
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,354
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 8:31am
Subject: Re: Is it possible that I don't like good coffee?
 

DeanOK Said:

With this machine, the best I can seem to come up with is two one ounce shots with the machine set to normal flavor, which I think is about 9 grams of coffee. This 1 oz shot is no more than 10 seconds not counting the pre-infusion. I have the grind set as fine as it will go, but it is no where nearly has fine as I used to grind my coffee when I used my old cheapo manual machine.

Posted October 2, 2012 link

That's not even espresso, and another problem with these super auto's, my friends Jura is the same way... pulls "watery" shots too fast. As an example I generally pull 1-2oz shots between 26-30 seconds from first drip which is after pre-infusion, with usually 16-18g of coffee right now. 10 second shot is just way too fast, your not even coming close to extracting the beans right so that right there is pry the reason your not liking the coffee as it's going to taste "off" no matter how you doctor it up. Those Juras and superautos in general don't reach the right brew temps and have no stability except for some high end ones. Example beans I have right now generally pulled at 200 degrees, actually changed it to 197 degree's to see a difference, that type of accuracy even right down to a 1 degree change can actually totally change the taste profile of the beans. I actually prefer med-just dark roast, but you may actually like a nice light-med roast better, like poster above said you should try that.

You really should look into a good semi-manual which will blow the superauto away... need a better grinder then your using now too, and if that doesn't work with fresh beans then maybe you really don't like coffee lol. But I wouldn't base that notion off what your doing right now b/c it's like somebody eating Burger King and thinking burgers in general suck b/c they've never had a mouth watering gourmet burger.

Shouldn't be gaining weight either, unless your throwing a ton of sugar and syrups in and drinking a bunch. Two a day shouldn't do anything, do you work out? I lift weights, 4 day split with Wed being a break, and have a morning iced latte, my protein shake post work out, and pry 4-5 other glasses of whole milk through out the day with food. Just having coffee and milk is good (iced latte imo is better than pre-workout products), milk is loaded with good fats, carbs and protein. Now if I was drinking what I said above w/o working out, pry get fatter lol... but you weren't drinking close to that.
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