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Netphilosopher
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Joined: 14 Jan 2011
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Posted Fri Jun 1, 2012, 9:38am
Subject: .
 

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Netphilosopher
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Location: USA
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Posted Fri Jun 1, 2012, 9:41am
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jpender
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jpender
Joined: 11 Jul 2011
Posts: 719
Location: California
Expertise: I like coffee

Grinder: OE LIDO
Vac Pot: S/S Moka Pot
Drip: Aeropress
Posted Fri Jun 1, 2012, 1:49pm
Subject: Re: Coffee Extraction Discussion, Questions for the membership:
 

Netphilosopher Said:

That's planning about 18 cups of coffee initially (3 steep times X 2 Temperatures X 3 grind levels).  Maybe a mid-temperature if required.

Posted June 1, 2012 link

That makes 27 cups. Does brew ratio affect extraction rate? Agitation? What about degree of roast? If you include those as variables you'll need to brew 3^6 cups. And if you insist on at least one replication per case that makes... more than year's worth of coffee!


Netphilosopher Said:

On the high strike temp brews, this grounds drop at this grind level happens around 2-3 minutes.  With the lower temperature, the grounds drop around 6 minutes.  I'm wondering if this is a potential signal that the brew is approaching equilibrium.

Posted June 1, 2012 link

Or how long it takes them to fully infuse with water. If infusion rate is what is limiting extraction on large particles then it might be the same thing.


Netphilosopher Said:

So, now I've found a way to determine maximum extraction - go ahead and brew, and then brew some more until you can't.  Keep track of everything you extract.

Posted June 1, 2012 link

At this point would it be easier and possibly more accurate to oven dehydrate the grounds?

By the way, how well can you correlate extraction yield from oven dehydration with what your refractometer tells you? To what extent can you simply take what you've filtered out of the beverage and add that to the dried grounds to get the same number? And what kind of filtering do you need to do to achieve this?

I'm curious because when I measure extraction yield of a moka pot brew through dehydration the value is always high even when the coffee tastes sour. I know there are a fair amount of solids in moka coffee; is it enough to simply filter the coffee through an Aeropress or does too much pass through this way?
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Sat Jun 2, 2012, 2:11pm
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Sat Jun 2, 2012, 2:37pm
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Jun 4, 2012, 8:46am
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Jun 4, 2012, 8:53am
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Jun 4, 2012, 9:05am
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jpender
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jpender
Joined: 11 Jul 2011
Posts: 719
Location: California
Expertise: I like coffee

Grinder: OE LIDO
Vac Pot: S/S Moka Pot
Drip: Aeropress
Posted Mon Jun 4, 2012, 1:14pm
Subject: Re: Coffee Extraction Discussion, Questions for the membership:
 

Netphilosopher Said:

So, bottom line is dehydration will carry some error with it unless you filter it with a VST filter or centrifuge the sample.  The grounds drying will be somewhat close, but will also carry the error as well, with no way to recover it.  Unfortunately, this error will be dependent on the filter, the grind size and how much fines are produced with the grind.

Posted June 2, 2012 link

That's what I thought. I'm disappointed in that it seems that I cannot expect to reliably adjust for it.

For moka coffee it might make sense to use solids yield like with espresso, instead of extraction. But to calculate the beverage strength you need to know how much of those extracted solids are dissolved versus undissolved.

Which leads to the question, how does mojo/VST do it?

With a refractometer all you know is the TDS from the filtered sample. The only way to determine the amount of undissolved solids, aside from dehydration, is through some function that relates dose and TDS to total solids. If you can do this with espresso why couldn't you do it with moka?

Or am I misunderstanding how mojo/VST works?
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Jun 4, 2012, 1:50pm
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