Our Valued Sponsor
OpinionsConsumer ReviewsGuides and How TosCoffeeGeek ReviewsResourcesForums
Coffee: Home Roasting Talk
Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
Rocket R58 Double Boiler
Rocket Espresso R58 Double Boiler -  Everything you need for the perfect shot!
www.seattlecoffeegear.com
 
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered  
Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Discussions > Coffee > Home Roast > Quest M3 Roaster...  
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
showing page 6 of 15 first page | last page previous page | next page
Author Messages
Endo
Senior Member
Endo
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 804
Location: , location, location.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: machine is < important than...
Grinder: !
Posted Sat Sep 29, 2012, 8:48am
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

250g at 1200W profile.

Endo: java_250g_1200w_cg.png
(Click for larger image)
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
pngboy
Senior Member


Joined: 24 Jun 2011
Posts: 29
Location: Harrisonburg
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Sat Sep 29, 2012, 9:25am
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

Looks good Endo.    Its deff very capable looking on the graph.    
  Thanks again Dave for the wealth of knowledge  and taking your time to explain it.   I'm deff going to give your way a try.   I guess its mostly a matter of developing my palate , experimenting  and finding out what tastes best to me.   What would your average drop temps be  for High grown and LG beans like brazil with 250g?  Just looking for a starting point when I try your method.  Right now I have a bunch of ethiopians and brazil beans I need to roast.   In F my drop temp would be about 400 for HG and 370 for LG with 170g  and no fan during  the drying phase.
 
            Cheers
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Endo
Senior Member
Endo
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 804
Location: , location, location.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: machine is < important than...
Grinder: !
Posted Sat Sep 29, 2012, 1:43pm
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

One of my favourite parts of the Quest....no burnt chaff (or even much smoke). And this is with 250g!

Endo: 2012-09-29 005 (310x207).jpg
(Click for larger image)
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
DavecUK
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,412
Location: UK
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sat Sep 29, 2012, 3:29pm
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

pngboy Said:

Looks good Endo.    Its deff very capable looking on the graph.    
  Thanks again Dave for the wealth of knowledge  and taking your time to explain it.   I'm deff going to give your way a try.   I guess its mostly a matter of developing my palate , experimenting  and finding out what tastes best to me.   What would your average drop temps be  for High grown and LG beans like brazil with 250g?  Just looking for a starting point when I try your method.  Right now I have a bunch of ethiopians and brazil beans I need to roast.   In F my drop temp would be about 400 for HG and 370 for LG with 170g  and no fan during  the drying phase.
 
            Cheers

Posted September 29, 2012 link

While cooling one roast, the heater is turned off. For the next roast I set the heater back up at 870W, and 20 seconds later drop the beans in....fan at 4.5. I suppose the temperature is around 200C ish. If it's the first roast I warm up at 750W to 200, then drop (750W, gives a slow warm up so that the roaster structure becomes warm, even then the first roast is always different to second and subsequent roasts). With such little thermal mass, the little quest is not going to tip or scorch the beans with high drop temps and once the beans are added it plummets to 130C or so anyway. It's not like a big 25kg gas probat, where you definitely wouldn't drop at 200C, more like 140C.

With high grown and low grown coffees it's dangerous to assume one can take a higher drop temperature than another...they will both tip and scorch just as easy in a big thermal mass roaster. The main difference is perhaps the amount of high temperature abuse they can take and how they react at 1st crack. I always tend to look at the line on the bean, if it's tight, then I assume denser, also with a roast look for frogs rather than toads when deciding if the roast went well.....this referring to the appearance of the outside of the bean..."nice and smooth" = frog, "not plump and smooth, but slightly rough" = Toad

P.S. Use your fan, more even heating and less strain on the heating element, plus it removes the moisture from the roaster chamber (after all your roasting not steaming)
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Endo
Senior Member
Endo
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 804
Location: , location, location.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: machine is < important than...
Grinder: !
Posted Mon Oct 1, 2012, 5:27am
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

More info from the manufacturer...

The Quest really is a custom made machine. Apparently mine has been designed specifically for the more northern countries like Canada where a little more power is required due to the colder ambient. They seem to suggest the changes are more than just the heater as well, since they don't sell the heater as a separate item.

So does this mean they have 3 different heaters? The first one (the one that broke all the time). The second more durable heater version (that is in the latest Coffeeshrub version). The third more powerful one that is on the left side of the "Canadian Edition Quest".

Or could it simply be they had a few old heaters hanging around and decided to save some bucks and make a version that has both? Hmmmm....
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
pngboy
Senior Member


Joined: 24 Jun 2011
Posts: 29
Location: Harrisonburg
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Mon Oct 1, 2012, 7:30pm
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

If its not broken I guess they could tell you anything, who know's if its true or not.  But if you can roast 250g 13-14 min it sounds like the roaster working pretty good.

 Usually when It come to drop temp for the beans I just look at what elevation its grown at.  Thanks for the advice on checking out how tight the fisher is on the bean I'll have to start doing that.    I've found that most of my roast that are around a city roast = more of a toad like bean   and Full City and up = nice and smooth, frog like.
 Wouldn't the amount of time it takes the temp to turn around after drop be almost as important as the drop temp.   I've seen profiles where the beans are dropped @ a lower temp but has a really quick turn around and other profiles where they are dropped @ higher temp and have a slower turn around.   I'm sure theres an affect on the roast but not quite sure what affect it would have.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
DavecUK
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,412
Location: UK
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 5:44am
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

Endo Said:

More info from the manufacturer...

The Quest really is a custom made machine. Apparently mine has been designed specifically for the more northern countries like Canada where a little more power is required due to the colder ambient. They seem to suggest the changes are more than just the heater as well, since they don't sell the heater as a separate item.

So does this mean they have 3 different heaters? The first one (the one that broke all the time). The second more durable heater version (that is in the latest Coffeeshrub version). The third more powerful one that is on the left side of the "Canadian Edition Quest".

Or could it simply be they had a few old heaters hanging around and decided to save some bucks and make a version that has both? Hmmmm....

Posted October 1, 2012 link

You're right to be suspicious....there's lies, then damn lies, then statistics, after this usually comes what manufacturers will say to defend their product. I don't remember the last time any manufacturer said "well, yup, their product is just better than ours, but we're nicer people"

In my hot little hand I have a couple of new heater elements..........In the UK they currently use 2 x 116V 600W heating elements for the UK and presumably European models. This gives a total of 232V, split down into 116V heating elements. Presumably they are simply splitting the sine wave then pulsing it to achieve the required control and power for each side. I am fairly careful not to apply more than around 900W, as the voltage in the UK is somewhat higher and can split at up to 124V per heating element. If they are run at near their maximum it can shorten the life or break down the internal insulation.

The roaster itself will also not like the heat generated at much more than 900W output, hence my recommendation to work in Watts (common unit of reference). Now in the US they presumably don't need to split the wave, but of course can use essentially the same heating elements (clever), as I doubt you have 2 x 60V elements..

I know of a few Quests sold in the last 3 months that have had very early heating element failures, hence why I thought they might have a bad batch. The elements in your photo simply don't look right, the explanation doesn't sound right.

If it were my roaster, I would take them out, see what's stamped on them, check the resistance, see if it's different compared to the ratings, swap them over. If it burns bright on the same side each time, then yes, they either have an asymmetrical control system by design, or by accident. If the brightness moves with the element (and if the ratings stamped on each are the same)...then you are undoubtedly being treated like a mushroom (kept in the dark and fed a load of ^&^&).

All the best

Dave
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
oldgearhead
Senior Member
oldgearhead
Joined: 25 Jan 2010
Posts: 396
Location: Go Colts!
Expertise: I like coffee

Grinder: Virtuoso by Baratza
Drip: Chemex,Dilongi DCM900
Roaster: 1/2K Fluid-bed
Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 6:14am
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

The Quest (600 watts) elements are rather low-powered. But putting two of them together and only drawing 1000 Watts, tells me they are always controlled at less than 100%. Furthermore, because they are never operated at 100%, suggests they are the 116V rated units.

From a cost standpoint, I cannot see the justification of having a 'drive' for each element. Therefore, it's my guess you might have one 116V (Euro) element and one 130 V (USA) element...
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Endo
Senior Member
Endo
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 804
Location: , location, location.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: machine is < important than...
Grinder: !
Posted Tue Oct 2, 2012, 7:04pm
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

oldgearhead Said:

The Quest (600 watts) elements are rather low-powered. But putting two of them together and only drawing 1000 Watts, tells me they are always controlled at less than 100%. Furthermore, because they are never operated at 100%, suggests they are the 116V rated units.

From a cost standpoint, I cannot see the justification of having a 'drive' for each element. Therefore, it's my guess you might have one 116V (Euro) element and one 130 V (USA) element...

Posted October 2, 2012 link

Interesting theory. Is there any way I can check this out?

I'll pull them out eventually, swap them, look for wattage stamp and check resistance. Right now I'm just enjoying roasting so it might be a few more weeks before this happens. Stay tuned...
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Endo
Senior Member
Endo
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 804
Location: , location, location.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: machine is < important than...
Grinder: !
Posted Tue Oct 16, 2012, 12:50pm
Subject: Re: Quest M3 Roaster - New Asymmetric Heating?
 

oldgearhead Said:

Therefore, it's my guess you might have one 116V (Euro) element and one 130 V (USA) element...

Posted October 2, 2012 link

Good guess, but it seems they are over-volting the hotter left side heater to get the extra heat for the "Canadian" edition.

Left side is 100V x 600W and cooler right side is the Euro model 116V x 600W.

What do you think of that?

My source reads 120V. I find I need 1200W for my 250g roasts (for under 15 minutes). Should I be worried about life of the left side heater?
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
showing page 6 of 15 first page | last page previous page | next page
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Discussions > Coffee > Home Roast > Quest M3 Roaster...  
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered     Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
Discussions Quick Jump:
Symbols: New Posts= New Posts since your last visit      No New Posts= No New Posts since last visit     Go to most recent post= Newest post
Forum Rules:
No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards.
No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum.
No SEO style postings will be tolerated. SEO related posts will result in immediate ban from CoffeeGeek.
No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum.
Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards.
Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics.
Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies.
Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies.
Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts.
Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
Find the Right Machine...
Package deals on the best machines from Izzo, Quick Mill, Rocket, La Marzocco & more.
www.clivecoffee.com
Home | Opinions | Consumer Reviews | Guides & How Tos | CoffeeGeek Reviews | Resources | Forums | Contact Us
CoffeeGeek.com, CoffeeGeek, and Coffee Geek, along with all associated content & images are copyright ©2000-2014 by Mark Prince, all rights reserved, unless otherwise indicated. Content, code, and images may not be reused without permission. Usage of this website signifies agreement with our Terms and Conditions. (0.339484930038)
Privacy Policy | Copyright Info | Terms and Conditions | CoffeeGeek Advertisers | RSS | Find us on Google+