Over the past few weeks I have been struggling with El Salvador Manzano SHG EP dry processed beans.
Problem #1: Sweet Maria's recommends Behmor P2 or P1. I find P2 very difficult to work with. The power dip never seems to be in the right place. That 'right place' seems to change with the line voltage. Those two things considered, I can't predict, by timing, when to terminate the roast.
Problem #2: This bean is VERY sensitive to timing. The difference between an under-roast (sour) and an over-roast (ashy) might be only 30 seconds. Furthermore, there is not much (if any) lull between the 1CR and the 2CR.
Problem #3: After the roast is completed it is almost impossible to tell what roast level I have achieved. An under-roast is medium brown. An over-roast is slightly darker with a minor oil sheen (but no oil spots). I have only succeeded once (after 2-1/2 lbs) to do a good roast. So I have 2 containers, 1 under and 1 good. If they were not labelled I could not tell which was which. All of them grow slightly darker after a week. And I will say this: The good roast is exceptional.
Problem #4: I have never encountered as much chaff in any other bean. My poor little vacuum cleaner is developing asthma.
Problem #5: I have never encountered as much bloom, when brewing. It almosts defeats the whole processs. Dealing with bloom in an Aeropress has been covered in other threads, and ...whatever they say ...I'm doing.
If anyone has any good advice, please post. I have 9-1/2 lbs left in inventory.
I was going to post about my recent hot-weather experiences with the Behmor (mosquito attacks notwithstanding).
------------------------------------------ ----------------------------------------- Le café doit être noir comme le diable, chaud comme l'enfer, pur comme un ange, et doux comme l'amour.
"There is no right answer with coffee. There is only the elixir in your cup at the moment you partake."
"...I often say that when you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind;..." - Lord Kelvin RECIPES thread => http://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/coffee/machines/585708
Posted Sat Sep 3, 2011, 10:32am Subject: Re: Troublesome Beans
JKalpin Said:
Problem #2: This bean is VERY sensitive to timing. The difference between an under-roast (sour) and an over-roast (ashy) might be only 30 seconds. Furthermore, there is not much (if any) lull between the 1CR and the 2CR.
I am not seeing this. I roasted yesterday for espresso, and the roast went for 3-1/2 minutes after 1C until I hit 435 BT and I didn't yet get a second crack. Unless I missed it with the first crack. I did notice some slightly quieter cracks at the end of 1C. The resulting roast was definitely in the FC color range. I also roasted to 430 BT for a more City+ range, and tasted it a few hours after roasting. Not sour in the Clever Coffee Dripper brew. Smooth and sweet with a bit of berry (black, rasp I dunno).
(edit) After a day's rest, the berry seems to be fading, and a tannic quality is emerging. Not really sour, but astringent. The espresso I tried this morning was definitely sour, but I might try changing dose to see if I can overcome that.
The roast is somewhat uneven, which might be expected for DP beans I think. I had to cull a few burned beans, and several underroasted.
FWIW, here's a chart of the BT measured where the air is leaving the beans (on my modified Poppery)
(Click for larger image)
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
Posted Sat Sep 3, 2011, 4:34pm Subject: Re: Troublesome Beans
I just got started with this bean myself. Always hoping for a bright and lively fruited DP, I went for a lighter faster roast. It was rough, and not pleasing with that tannic/astringent finish. Second batch I went more conservative slowed the drying to full 4 minutes and finish almost 4 minutes to Full City. Just tasted a couple days ago, and much better balance & developed flavor, mostly gone astringent finish. OOps, already blended with 1/3 El Salvador Finca Siberia Bourbon....
This is one case where I think temperature measurement would be a big help.
With the Behmor I time the conclusion of the roast from the onset of the 1CR. 1:45 seems to be right for me, provided that the line voltage is in a range of 118 - 120V. If i give it 15 seconds more it runs away and I end up with 30 seconds of 2CR and an unpleasant ashy taste. And 1:30 min after the 1CR gives me a sour light roast. As I said previously, there is not much change in colour and I also agree that the roast is never as even as I have with other beans.
Many roasting experts agree, for example, Willem Boot, http://www.bootcoffee.com/articles.html that you really need at least 3 minutes after the onset of first crack before you complete the roast. I find 3.5 to 4 minutes works best in my profiles.
The key here is to control the heat in the roast at this point, and for medium to light roasts it's a bit of a tightrope to achieve and sustain enough heat for a good first crack, while not running too fast to second or stalling the roast by removing too much heat.
Not much here for reference on the Behmor. but the ET(Environment Temp) I run to achieve a good first crack is 460-465F. If I hold this temp for the entire finish, I will approach or just start second crack in about 4 minutes finish time. An ET of 455F is just enough heat to get a good first crack in reasonable time; the lower ET temp limit. Much over 470F for any length of time in the finish will get well into second crack before 4 minutes finish. I think that's a tight temperature window to hit consistently and I couldn't do it in the Poppery without a good ET thermometer. With ET control, I can turn out batch after batch to the same roast profile.
Interesting to note also; in order to maintain a constant 460F ET finish temp requires a gradual reduction in power to the heater through the finish phase. ( this with a popper that brings in fresh ambient air to heat.)
This week I'm roasting the Panama DP; Siete Dias de Bellota, but something else on the El Salvador DP worth noting; it seemed to resist heat in the drying, taking more time. It may just be the extra moisture from a fresh crop and the hard Bourbon bean, but it may be the remaining parchment adds some insulation to resist heating early in the roast. I would think this as much an issue with radiant heat of the Behmor as it would be for an air roaster.
Taking enough time for even drying. ( I doubt this is a problem on the Behmor, but really don't know) but mostly I think you need to get finish times up from 1.5 minutes to 3-4 minute range. This is where you will get the most flavor development going from the sour and astringent notes to the full flavored and more balanced roast.
the ET(Environment Temp) I run to achieve a good first crack is 460-465F. If I hold this temp for the entire finish, I will approach or just start second crack in about 4 minutes finish time. An ET of 455F is just enough heat to get a good first crack in reasonable time; the lower ET temp limit. Much over 470F for any length of time in the finish will get well into second crack before 4 minutes finish. I think that's a tight temperature window to hit consistently and I couldn't do it in the Poppery without a good ET thermometer. With ET control, I can turn out batch after batch to the same roast profile.
I am running a similar profile. Basically, I ramp up to 350 ET (300 BT) for the 4-5 min drying phase, then 3-4 mins up to 445 at about 8 mins which I hold for 1 min. The BT hits around 390 at 8 mins, and often starting 1C, and it rises up to about 410 in the next minute. THen I take a leisurely 4 mins to 465, which is a finishing BT of about 435-438, for a Full City roast, on the edge of 2C.
For this bean, I am experimenting with a ramp going from 250 ET for 1 minute straight to 445 ET in either 4, 5, or 6 more minutes, followed by a 445 for 1 minute hold, then a 4 minute finish to about 460. I'm hoping this will bring out more sweetness, but it may fail miserably. I will try them (roasted yesterday) in a few days. The shortest roast didn't really hit first crack until after I got through the 445 holding period. That makes me think the beans just couldn't soak up the heat that fast.
Dana Leighton - Espresso hack and CoffeeGeek moderator
All the constants are variable. Now mostly using softer ramp delta (ET-BT=70 to 75F)... higher early, lower as first crack approaches. Ending ET 465, I still run 465F to achieve first crack. once underway I back off to 460F for Full City. Lighter roast back off to 455. Light and slow just finishes at 455.
...but something else on the El Salvador DP worth noting; it seemed to resist heat in the drying, taking more time. It may just be the extra moisture from a fresh crop and the hard Bourbon bean, but it may be the remaining parchment adds some insulation to resist heating early in the roast. I would think this as much an issue with radiant heat of the Behmor as it would be for an air roaster.
Taking enough time for even drying. ( I doubt this is a problem on the Behmor, but really don't know) but mostly I think you need to get finish times up from 1.5 minutes to 3-4 minute range. This is where you will get the most flavor development going from the sour and astringent notes to the full flavored and more balanced roast.
The Behmor manual recommends their P2 profile for the Manzano.
It has full power up to 66% of the roast time, where it drops to 66% of the power, until 90% of the roast, whereupon it goes back to full power. This might be what you are doing, using temperature as your guide. But it's impossible to visualize in the Behmor, particularly if you add in 1:30 min of drying time ...!!
I had a recent email from Danny Hall at Rainfrog Inc. He is working on an upgrade to his Roastmaster app and it sounds like it will drop that curve (or a temperature curve) on the chart it generates while you roast. Maybe it is wishful thinking on my part, but ...!!
Now, about the extreme bloom in my Aeropress from the Manzano: I found good results in starting with a very small amount of hot water. I stir it half a dozen times to get it properly wet. Just as a pot of porridge does not foam (just goes bloop bloop) the thick coffee slurry does not foam. But it does release the CO2. Then I fill it up with hot water, stir a bit, wait a minute and 'plunge'. Much less problems with bloom.
... Now, about the extreme bloom in my Aeropress from the Manzano: I found good results in starting with a very small amount of hot water. I stir it half a dozen times to get it properly wet. Just as a pot of porridge does not foam (just goes bloop bloop) the thick coffee slurry does not foam. But it does release the CO2. Then I fill it up with hot water, stir a bit, wait a minute and 'plunge'. Much less problems with bloom.
Glad to hear it. I've been using this technique to max-out my little melitta BCM-4 with 45g of coffee and max brew water without causing contact of the bloom with the dispersion top.
------------------------------------------ ----------------------------------------- Le café doit être noir comme le diable, chaud comme l'enfer, pur comme un ange, et doux comme l'amour.
"There is no right answer with coffee. There is only the elixir in your cup at the moment you partake."
"...I often say that when you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind;..." - Lord Kelvin RECIPES thread => http://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/coffee/machines/585708
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