The_Mighty_Bean Senior Member Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 463 Location: Bowie, MD Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: "Beauty" (the gentle and... Grinder: Gi-normous Rossi RR45; 100... Vac Pot: I just got lectured about... Drip: French press purist, have a... Roaster: Borrowed HearthWare...
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 12:31pm Subject: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
Hello,
Next week, I am likely to try my first non-stovetop roasts.
I would like to be able to vary my batch size between about 1/8 lb and 1/2 lb, depending on whether I'm experimenting with roast profiles, or preparing a weeks' supply. I would like to be able to exert lots of control over the roast profile. I don't want it to suffer from the lack of brightness that I've heard about in the Behmor, and I don't want it to lose body, as I have heard is characteristic of small hot-air roasters.
I don't mind supervising the roast, but I would like to have repeatable results and not be throwing away lots of batches.
Also, I want it cheap. Preferaby $100 or less if I source the components used. :) It's okay if I have to buy a thermocouple over and above that.
Might a drum roaster inside a Foreman/Ronco rotisserie meet my needs? What are the drawbacks to that method and will I need an extension cord or a variac? I don't really want to pay for a variac.
Also, if I start out with a popcorn popper and oven thermometer pairing, how can I really get the most out of that? Should I attach an extension cord to slow down the roast time?
Thanks!
~tMb
PS kitchen is in the back of my house and unventilated so I am likely to be roasting outside.... I do have an outlet on the porch to plug in the roaster of choice.
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 3:21pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
The_Mighty_Bean Said:
Hello, I would like to be able to vary my batch size between about 1/8 lb and 1/2 lb, depending on whether I'm experimenting with roast profiles, or preparing a weeks' supply. I would like to be able to exert lots of control over the roast profile. I don't want it to suffer from the lack of brightness that I've heard about in the Behmor, and I don't want it to lose body, as I have heard is characteristic of small hot-air roasters.
Bright roasts are easy on the Behmor. Put in a smaller amount of beans (say 1/4#) and select (1/2#) and (P1) and you'll get enough brightness for your tastes. Having said that, the TO/SC and now the Behmor convinced my taste buds that bright roasts are not as satisfying as a smooth roast brought on by better heat and time management.
The_Mighty_Bean Said:
Might a drum roaster inside a Foreman/Ronco rotisserie meet my needs? What are the drawbacks to that method and will I need an extension cord or a variac? I don't really want to pay for a variac.
Also, if I start out with a popcorn popper and oven thermometer pairing, how can I really get the most out of that? Should I attach an extension cord to slow down the roast time? Thanks! ~tMb
The rotisserie roasters have not met with as much success as anticipated. Not enough heat output, I believe.
For less than a $100 you can get a popper (< $5 at thrift store), Variac ($30-60 on ebay or source one at an old electronics store) and thermometer ($10 - $30) will give you LOTS of room to learn and control your roasts.
Four about the same money you can get a Turbo Oven and Stir-Crazy type system. I don't use the Variac with mine. Better roasts most all the time and higher amounts at a time.
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 3:51pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
My self used the turbo oven and stir crazy and moved up to the bread machine and heat gun i think works a lot better and faster with a more even roast the stir crazy motor is sure weak and any thing near a pound of coffee will give it all it can handle vs the bread machine on the dough cycle spins the hell out of the beans for a much more even roast and so easy to control. Bread machines can be had at the good will for cheap or any thrift shop will have them you maybe have one in your closet with dust on it here is recycling at its finest the heat gun can be a $10.00 item from Harbor Fright and will do a fine job No reason to spend mega bucks until you know this is what you really want to do! it will run you in the hundreds of dollars to buy a machine to do the same thing
tahoejoe Senior Member Joined: 9 Sep 2003 Posts: 314 Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv. Expertise: I live coffee
Grinder: Solis Maestro Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 4:10pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
I'm here merely to opine on the rotisserie idea..given I own the patent rights to the adapters for the Ronco.
The issue with regards to the Ronco is heat containment and direction of rotation of the cylinder.
If you notice on a Ronco the system is designed in such a way the main body of beans are rotating away from the elements and at a distance. The Ronco is not fully enclosed either around the edges so you have tremendous heat loss..
My design overcame these issues but then you deal with Zero cooling, poor chaff collection and tons of smoke..
I still have one in my garage...it was the means by which I learned how to roast, and the issues dealing with roasting. Smoke, cooling, chaff etc... thus the Behmor..
As to the George Foreman...too low of wattage...poor positioning of the elements for roasting..plus positioning that would exacerbate the smoke issue even further when chaff would fall on the elements also making for a major ass fire hazard...
What the answer is for you is yours to decide.... IMHO forget the GF idea and only consider the Ronco if you already own one..and then plan on using it only for roasting...
gime2much Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,398 Location: Sunny S Fl Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Pavoni, Astoria comm, 2... Grinder: La Pavoni Zip, Bunn... Drip: Bunn comm Roaster: Popcorn popper (air),co/ufo
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 4:38pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
tahoejoe Said:
..
As to the George Foreman...too low of wattage...poor positioning of the elements for roasting..plus positioning that would exacerbate the smoke issue even further when chaff would fall on the elements also making for a major ass fire hazard...
What the answer is for you is yours to decide.... IMHO forget the GF idea and only consider the Ronco if you already own one..and then plan on using it only for roasting...
I might add the Big George with the 6 temperature settings will get plenty hot (450f + measured) but has HUGE temp swings (dead band) and the basket rotates much to slow.
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 6:21pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
When you look at all the DIY home roasting devices, it's curious how they are all made with things that tend to show up in thrift stores... (SC, TO, BM, popper) I think most of the success or failure of the various methods is determined by your dedication to careful technique and investing time in learning how to overcome any limitations.
I think a Variac is a wise investment for any of these approaches as it is the best way to get stable temperature control out of the heater. With all the small roasters, batch size will affect the profile. As already pointed out, if you want a brighter roast(Behmor), roast a smaller batch. I can get a bright 9 minute roast or a flat 20 minute bake with a popper by adjusting the heater. The roast style is more determined by this than it is by the roaster you choose. (within reason, ie: if a larger drum load can't heat the beans to 1C in less than 15 minutes, etc)
I likely will end up building my own roasting machine to suit my needs. (....some day) Ability to see the beans clearly ( I finish by color mostly.) tryer hole would be fine. Ability to monitor bean temp and (max)environment temp. Ability to control heater precisely and reapeatably. Ability to dump the beans when they are done for quick cooling. Powerful (and efficient) enough to evenly heat the beans to 1C in 8 minutes or less without scorching.
The_Mighty_Bean Senior Member Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 463 Location: Bowie, MD Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: "Beauty" (the gentle and... Grinder: Gi-normous Rossi RR45; 100... Vac Pot: I just got lectured about... Drip: French press purist, have a... Roaster: Borrowed HearthWare...
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 9:27pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
Thanks everyone, nothing is ever simple in this little hobby, huh? Frost, I love your posts, I wish I had a pocket-sized version of you at home to tweak my espresso and roasting setups. You also bring up an important and frustrating digression that I thought of, subsequent to my original post here. Batch size affects the profile. So when testing blends, you can't roast up a tiny amount to "try it" because the profile is going have to change when you are ready to roast up 3 or 10 or 20 times as much of your chosen bean blend. How do roasters compensate for that? Seems like guesswork to get the larger bean mass to replicate the roasting results of the smaller one.
Allrighty then, I've already got an appropriate popper and a 550f thermometer (the tiny one from Sweet Maria's), so I'm gonna nab a Variac on Ebay and start out that way. Hey, any CG's with upgrade fever got an old one to unload?
Also, the first time I see a working Behmor at about half price, I'll probably pounce. Did you guys see that INCREDIBLE sale at Sweet Maria's last week? They unloaded two demo Gene Cafes and an old Hottop (nonprogrammable) for 50 bucks a piece! I was just a hair too slow on the trigger.
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 9:34pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
$50 for a Gene or Hottop? Wow, that's insane. I have only seen a few dented Behmors but they were still over $200. I need to start checking that site every day.
The_Mighty_Bean Senior Member Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 463 Location: Bowie, MD Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: "Beauty" (the gentle and... Grinder: Gi-normous Rossi RR45; 100... Vac Pot: I just got lectured about... Drip: French press purist, have a... Roaster: Borrowed HearthWare...
Posted Sat Feb 23, 2008, 10:22pm Subject: Re: Roasting noob. Drum roaster? Popcorn popper?
haha I've been doing that obsessively for the last week in hopes of scoring a deal, but it seems like this was a rare, clear-the-shelves-of-old-stock event. The list of sale items is steadily dwindling. As of a few hours ago, there was still one Technivorm, I think at $210, not sure how much of a discount it represents.
Nonetheless, can't hurt to check from time to time.
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